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Post by CELS on Jan 17, 2004 20:29:12 GMT -5
Ok, so most of our artists are gone, presumably temporarily, but I think we might as well start discussing the Anargo crest without them. If not start scetching, then at least settle on some of the symbolism and key features of the crest, and the colours.
Last thing first, I think our colours should be closely related to the colours for the Anargo Navy. Did anyone check out my suggestions in the Portent gallery btw? Which one did you like, if any of them? If you have other colour suggestions, let me hear it.
So, what else would have set its mark on the Anargo crest?
The Great Crusade. Look at which Legion conquered the sector, and perhaps add something to remember that the Custodes and the Emperor himself were once here.
The Age of Aposty, which possibly saw some great inter-sector heresy.
The Frostwraiths?
Ancient Proteus, with its Knight world(s)?
The war with the orks?
Then we think about how we would represent this. The presence of the Emperor could be represented with a star or a halo, showing that the sector was blessed by 'His' presence.
The Vandire Heresy-thing should be looked at when we work out exactly what happened to the 'cursed subsector'
The Frostwraiths could be represented by an Angel, or a pair of wings, to symbolize the Angels of Death protecting the Sector.
The AM presence could be demonstrated by an iron cog, like the one on the AM badge...
The war with the orks could be represented by a weapon, or a skull, or maybe an ork skull with a spear or sword through it, or a gauntlet...
To combine this...
A shield with a circle, half halo (twelve-pointed star, like the Iron Halo), half iron cog (AM), with wings in the background, and whatever ork-war symbol in the foreground.
Suggestions? Comments?
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Post by Minister on Jan 21, 2004 4:40:10 GMT -5
Personaly? A shield of black upon which a spear with the Imperial eagle clutching it in it's talons (less stylised than is the norm, represented more like a "real" animal). Below this the mark of the famous Warmaster Anargo's regiment, the crossed Basilisk guns within a wreath and with a sword superemposed ontop. there could then by the symbol of the Mechanicus on the top left and the Dorvastor cult on the right top. All charges represented in gold.
Of course, it's only a random thought.
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Post by Sojourner on Jan 21, 2004 15:50:35 GMT -5
A quartered orange-and-black shield
Upon which is mounted the cog-and-halo design described before.
Upon which sits a gold-coloured two-headed eagle
and through which sit a pair of crossed spears.
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Post by CELS on Jan 21, 2004 16:12:49 GMT -5
Right. We seem to like Spears. Any reason why we choose this weapon, instead of the classical sword or axe? Did anyone important wield a spear? I know Rogal Dorn supposedly did, along with Leman Russ (damned uninventive BL authors). The Emperor had a sword and a powerfist, I think. Definitely not a spear. The Custodes guy had a halberd (if you ask the guys in the Dorvastor subsector). So why a spear? Symbolism, people!  And what about choice of colours? Black doesn't make very nice banners, IMO. We are choosing the Anargo colour, remember. Why black (and orange)? |
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Post by Sojourner on Jan 21, 2004 16:23:42 GMT -5
I was led to believe that red and orange are the Anargo colours? and as they're too similar to go together, black is substituted.
Why spears? Because they're different. Swords are so cliche.
I don't like representing alien images on Imperial heraldry, their very existence is blasphemous and to sully your noble colours with their image would be reprehensible.
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Post by CELS on Jan 21, 2004 17:00:31 GMT -5
I was led to believe that red and orange are the Anargo colours? and as they're too similar to go together, black is substituted. It seems someone has misled you. Red and orange was merely a suggestion. Why Black though? Why not blue or green or white or purple? Crests, like national flags, should have proud, blazing colours. Not a lot of flags today with black, grey and brown. Why spears? Because they're different. Swords are so cliche. I would still like some symbolism...  I don't like representing alien images on Imperial heraldry, their very existence is blasphemous and to sully your noble colours with their image would be reprehensible. Say that to the Ultramarines' 3rd Company But I would tend to agree. |
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Post by Minister on Jan 21, 2004 18:00:40 GMT -5
Right, halberd it is then. I just didn't want to push my own concept on people (although I was hoping someone else would mention it...) ;D
Besides, I like black. And red for that matter.
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Post by Kage2020 on Jan 21, 2004 18:42:40 GMT -5
Another idea... Why do we have to incorporate weapon imagery? Why not purity seals, or scrolls, or somesuch. The seal doesn't have to be paintable, or at least directly so (free hand). Say the traditional Imperial eage with claws outstretched, holding a scroll case with the scroll joined between in a rough semi-circle. The Anargo motto on it (see below) with something between the legs of the eagle or surrounding it? What about a nice motto: Carpe carp or some such... (Yes, I know that's a stupid example.) Kage |
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Post by CELS on Jan 21, 2004 19:03:48 GMT -5
Like I said, I don't like black as a colour for a crest. It's not a good colour, heraldry- and tradition-wise. It's the colour for traitors and mercenaries, (and bad asses like Space Marines)
If you look at most family crests (Dare I say all) from europe, you'll notice that they all have very proud colours, and that there is no black and grey. The same goes for the various countries' flags.
As for the choice of a weapon imagery, that was merely a suggestion based on the fact that there has been a lot of conflict in this sector, and that it is really shaped by this conflict. One might argue that this is true for most Imperial sectors, but there you go.
I have no problem with something other than a weapon though, but I would appreciate some kind of symbolism. Personally, I've never seen purity seals feature on banners and crests in 40k (they're added in the flesh), but I have seen scrolls, banners and books.
Perhaps, then, a quartered crest (of whatever colours) with a circle in the background. On two quarters, this circle is in the form of an AM cog, and on the other two quarters, a twelve-pointed star / halo.
In the foreground, a non-stylised eagle holding the motto of Anargo....?
If we do have weapons, and a halberd, maybe a the halberd is behind the eagle...
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Post by Minister on Jan 22, 2004 5:10:27 GMT -5
Seems like we ned a few sketches...
Anyway, the moto would most likley be presented on a scolly sort of thing, as traditionaly used for presenting names on Marine banners amongst other things. "And from the Ashes, a new Rule"? Referencing the end of the Age of the Apostacy if we go down the rebelion and subsiquent re-structuring road for the history.
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Post by CELS on Jan 22, 2004 8:14:29 GMT -5
I'm a fan of lat- erm, High Gothic mottos on banners and crests, myself.
And yeah, the motto would be written on a scrolly kind of thing, which I believe is normally called a banner. Would be cool to find some latin motto that was along the lines of what Minister wrote though...
Here's a few random latin quotes...
- Fax mentis incedium gloriae (The passion of glory is the torch of the mind.)
- "Per aspera ad astra" (through the thorns to the stars)
- "Ne conjugare nobiscum" (Don't f*** with us)
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Post by Minister on Jan 22, 2004 9:14:50 GMT -5
An age ago I found a little "translate to lattin" programe on the 'net. Anyone remember the adress?
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Post by ZarkTheDamned on Jan 22, 2004 16:20:21 GMT -5
I was led to believe that red and orange are the Anargo colours? and as they're too similar to go together, black is substituted. May have been my fault, those are the colours I used on my initial homepage concept art. As for the eagle, would a modification of this work?:  I still have the original files kicking around. Yes, I know it's the Iraqi Eagle, I made it for a friend who was doing a project. Anyway, it should be easy enough to add a second head, modify the details and add spears/symbols etc. |
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Post by CELS on Jan 22, 2004 16:35:01 GMT -5
Cool! Would it be possible to increase the wingspan and decrease the length and thickness of the legs?
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Post by ZarkTheDamned on Jan 22, 2004 16:47:54 GMT -5
I can change pretty much anything on the image, I have the originals. I'll wait for a couple more suggestions before doing any changes, otherwise there will end up being tons of little changes, much easier to do them all at once  |
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