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Post by CELS on May 31, 2004 1:20:51 GMT -5
After reading Sojourner's short piece on private ship constructers, I realized that we must come up with a classification system of civilian ships to compliment GWs military system. From BFG, the classification hierarchy for Imperial ships is as follows;
- Battleship / Battle Barge
- Grand Cruiser
- Cruiser / Battle Cruiser
- Light Cruiser / Strike Cruiser
- Frigate
- Destroyer
- Attack craft (Bombers, interceptors, assault boats, etc)
In addition, I propose that we have 'Corvette' as an intermediate between attack craft and destroyer, as I've previously suggested in the Eldar scout ship-thread.
For non-military / civilian ships, another hierarchy is needed. We need to list all the different classes used by GW. Off the top of my head, I remember
- Super-heavy Barge (Malleus page 146, by Dan Abnett. Eisenhorn hitched a ride with an AM Barge)
- Cruiser (Rogue Traders have cruisers that are not used by the Navy, according to the latest BFG publications.)
- Bulk clipper (Xenos page 76, by Dan Abnett. Eisenhorn leased the 'Essene', owned by rogue trader Tobius Maxilla. This ship was approximately 3000 meters long and 700 meters broad. Of course, all ships in Abnett's novels are stupendously large. I seem to recall a ship that was 11 km's...)
Now, we need to fill out this list of non-Navy ships, from the absolutely greatest (presumably the Super-Heavy Barge) to the smallest (corvettes, shuttles, cutters)
Help.
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Post by Sojourner on May 31, 2004 3:57:52 GMT -5
Actually, the Corvette I described was intended to be a fighter-type vessel, similar in size to a Fury, but of course not armed straight out of the factory.
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Post by CELS on May 31, 2004 4:14:23 GMT -5
I know. But I disagreed with you ;D
In real life, corvettes are slightly smaller than frigates, from what I gather. Since destroyers are actually smaller than frigates in the 40k universe, I think corvettes should be even smaller than destroyers, and thus fill the gap between destroyers and attack craft. From what I remember, destroyers are a few hundred meters long, whilst attack craft are 50-100 meters. I suggest that the corvette should be somewhere in between.
So the "luxury corvette" you describe sounds like a great idea, but I wouldn't call it a corvette. IMO, we need a class between destroyer and attack craft, and destroyer fits the bill perfectly, for the reason I gave above.
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Post by Sojourner on May 31, 2004 4:32:20 GMT -5
Cutter, then?
Also, it depends on your interpretation of what's necessary for a personal vehicle. The Scimitar was intended to be capable of transporting perhaps a dozen passengers in relative luxury, plus a smallish crew and maybe fifty tonnes of cargo.
Incidentally - I wouldn't seperate Battlecruisers and Line Cruisers - they're not actually any different in tonnage, battlecruisers are just armed for large-scale naval combat rather than all-purpose-and-patrols as with the regulars.
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Post by CELS on May 31, 2004 4:37:19 GMT -5
Fair point about the battle cruiser. Yeah, cutter sounds like an appropriate name for that. Of course, that leaves us with the task of figuring out what a cutter is Bigger than a shuttle and smaller than a corvette?
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Post by Minister on May 31, 2004 7:58:08 GMT -5
From both my usage and a few assorted novels, a cutter is a small vessel, non-combatant, used by larger ships as a small transport for ship-to-ship and ship-to-shore (planet) opperations. Eisenhorn's infamous gun cutter is an upgraded version of this class, carrying defensive armaments. In effect, a type of shuttle, and non warp-capable. A Pinacle, by the way, is a larger, longer ranged and more heavily defended vessel of the same sort.
EDIT: Add Heavy Cruisers in with the others of their group.
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Post by CELS on May 31, 2004 9:02:42 GMT -5
What is heavy cruiser? Between line cruiser and grand cruiser?
Could you elaborate on the pinacle, Minister? Are you suggesting that it's slightly larger than a cutter, and capable of warp travel?
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Post by Minister on May 31, 2004 12:22:40 GMT -5
The Heavy Cruiser is basicaly the same as a battlecruiser. Consult the CHaos fleet list in the BFG BBB.
I was not intending for the Pinacle to be a warp ship, no. I'm counting the larger shuttles as being in this group.
Probably also add Warp Scouts to this list. THe smallest ships the Navy runs (ships here being the warp-capable ones) it has a crew of 5-20 (not sure quite where yet), Astropath, Navigator and all the sensors that they can fit onboard. Sometimes used as couriers.
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Post by CELS on May 31, 2004 12:40:34 GMT -5
So...
- Battleship / Battle Barge
- Grand Cruiser
- Cruiser / Battle Cruiser / Heavy Cruiser
- Light Cruiser / Strike Cruiser
- Frigate
- Destroyer
- Corvette
- Attack craft (Bombers, interceptors, assault boats, etc)
+ + +
As for Warp scouts... where have you read about these? I would appreciate it if everyone would name their source at this stage, before we start filling in the gaps ourselves.
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Post by Sojourner on May 31, 2004 21:52:54 GMT -5
Cutter sounds about right for 'my' vessels, then. Capable of crossing a star system alone given some time, and transported inside warp vessels for inter-system duty.
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Post by Lordof on Jun 1, 2004 2:29:24 GMT -5
In the book EoT isn't the Rogue Traders craft exceptionally small yet is Warp Capable?
Also in the novel Farseer he seems to have a rather small ship
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Post by CELS on Jun 1, 2004 2:58:35 GMT -5
I don't have EoT. Could you look through it and see if you find a name for the ship type, LordOf?
I'll go look through my copy of Farseer.
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Post by Lordof on Jun 1, 2004 3:45:53 GMT -5
I couldn't get length but its a rather small Cargo ship ship which is no more than 90 feet high (So makes my guess of about say 300ft long)
But its such a small ship that it is required to use small quantity high price scarcity goods to make money.
But its Warp capable and requires a Navigator.
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Post by Sojourner on Jun 1, 2004 3:52:19 GMT -5
I would have thought that such a small ship possessing a warp drive would be unusual - reserved only for fairly special people.
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Post by CELS on Jun 1, 2004 4:23:48 GMT -5
There was no mention of the ship type other than 'Cargo ship'? Hmph... Farseer does not mention the type of Janus' ship. Iit is merely called an Imperial starship. Of course, star ship is a seperate ship type in BFG. Tau cruisers are called 'star ships'
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