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Post by Femerenden on Mar 5, 2004 10:20:10 GMT -5
I am saying that how about The Frots Wraiths or Frost Bringers are never existed? We will be more free in our lands and for why i am saying this
- If any of the cults will reach out to some high rank in one of the sectors planets due to the genes of the Adeptus Astertates they will purge the planet w/out thinking who is responsiable. In thier eyes every one in that planet has petrayed the Emperor.
- Happening of this in the Home system of a chapter may result in the chapter purging the Whole sub-sector for their crimes against the Emperor.
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Post by CELS on Mar 5, 2004 11:06:10 GMT -5
Not all Space Marines are mindless killers or zealots. I don't see why they would do the things you say. Can you back it up with fluff?
If you are familiar with the background of the Celestial Lions, you'll remember that those Space Marines destroyed a cult that had corrupted the Priesthood of Khattar, but left the rest of the planet untouched. When Inquisitor Apollyon exterminated the planet, the Celestial Lions were outraged, since they saw no reason to kill those who did not belong to the cult.
Besides, the presence of Space Marines was decided in the early days of the project, and we've already done some work on them. And remember that many 40k players live and breathe for Space Marines, and would find it regrettable if this sector had none. We had a hard enough time limiting the presence to a single Chapter, with people asking if there could be a local Blood Angel, Ultramarine or Deathwatch base or whatever.
And as a last point, I think the presence of Space Marines offers more interesting consequences than the lack of them. There's the matter of recruiting, the meddling of the Space Marines, and the whole idea of grudge between the Alpha Legion and the Frost Wraiths...
We should definitely keep the Space Marines.
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Post by Minister on Mar 5, 2004 14:37:35 GMT -5
They're all zealots, it's just that some are more focused than others. ;D
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Post by Femerenden on Mar 5, 2004 15:14:09 GMT -5
Do not forget that if a Celestial Lions player loses a squad in some GW tourney or smtn like that the whole chapter will be lost.
Because what they have done on that pathetic planet they are cursed by the Inquisition that they will never receive real information will be sended to suicide missions and even some of the finest warriors of the chapter have been executed by the =][= as Traitors.
And do not forget that they have genes which makes them zealots.
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Post by zholud on Mar 5, 2004 15:23:41 GMT -5
I am glad to see that this topic is back and hot  Some points: - No Space Marines is too much out of mainstream GW and this isn’t good.
- They are successors of ultramarines because we tried to keep the smell of cheese off, so we concentrated on fluff, not rules. I guess we may change it later, but we need good story first
- The cults exist even on the chapters’ homeworlds, just look at the first Space Wolf novel where some cleanse action happens. Recall that sector is really large place, with million of stars, only less that 1% of which is Imperial…
I hope I didn’t offend anyone.  |
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Post by Femerenden on Mar 5, 2004 15:52:02 GMT -5
Am I Understanding Right Part of the Post: - Frots Wraiths name have been chosen because of the temprature of the vacuum and the fearsomeness of an undead. - There is no GW made chapter with some sort of near name. The real post: I insist that the name is crap(Sorry  ). Reasons why: - Frost + Wraith gives no impulse. They are not happy to be a pair. Wriath is a well known undead and due to they are being a myth(if one of us has not seen one they are) and undeads are due to myths are known to bring cold with them the Frost at there loses its meaning. " We are a real cold chapter that even my fingers are now frozen". Dubble cold meanings = Meaninglessness - Why Wraith? Are they dead? are they imply that "If the Emperor somehow brings our doom we will huant the whole Imperium". - Whence all of the Space Marines focuses on protecting the Emperor's ground why our Frost Wraiths are protecting the Vessels(Ground) of the NAVY? Note: Sorry but i havent come up with a good idea on name; but sooner or later i wiil findone... |
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Post by zholud on Mar 5, 2004 15:54:02 GMT -5
Not all Space Marines are mindless killers or zealots. I don't see why they would do the things you say. Can you back it up with fluff? They aren’t mindless for sure  they are as bright as ordinary human with good training in specific disciplines which for sure include strategy and thus planning and probably logic. If you are familiar with the background of the Celestial Lions, you'll remember that those Space Marines destroyed a cult that had corrupted the Priesthood of Khattar, but left the rest of the planet untouched. When Inquisitor Apollyon exterminated the planet, the Celestial Lions were outraged, since they saw no reason to kill those who did not belong to the cult. I hate this piece for the fact that readers are sure that Lions were right and Inquisitor, for whom it is profession to search for cults and other social cancer, is totally wrong.   |
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Post by zholud on Mar 5, 2004 16:01:39 GMT -5
- Frots Wraiths name have been chosen because of the temprature of the vacuum and the fearsomeness of an undead... Vacuum is emptiness and thus by definition has no temperature. As to the name, I agree with you on the wraith piece, but what about Frostbringers |
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Post by Minister on Mar 5, 2004 16:52:45 GMT -5
There is no such thing as a true vacum, there is always a small quantity of particulate matter (even at a density of something like 10^-50 mol m^-3). Besides, as soon as something is in space to measure it, that thing is there...
"- Whence all of the Space Marines focuses on protecting the Emperor's ground why our Frost Wraiths are protecting the Vessels(Ground) of the NAVY?"
The Marines follow the old idea of being troops capable and willing to fight anywhere any anywhere. "Per astra, per mer, per teram" or simmilar. THey are also regularly(ish) called upon to clear space hulks etc.
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Post by CELS on Mar 6, 2004 3:31:53 GMT -5
Femerenden wrote...
- Frost + Wraith gives no impulse. Wriath is a well known undead and due to they are being a myth(if one of us has not seen one they are) and undeads are due to myths are known to bring cold with them the Frost at there loses its meaning. Dubble cold meanings = MeaninglessnessPerhaps my knowledge on the undead is lacking, but I don't think the name Wraith implies cold. Are you claiming that Wraiths are known to bring cold with them in all myths, or just one or two that you are familiar with? Femerenden wrote...
Why Wraith? Are they dead? are they imply that "If the Emperor somehow brings our doom we will huant the whole Imperium".No, they are not dead. Nor are the Blood Angels claiming to really be angels, or the Space Wolves to be wolves. There's another official chapter called the Star Phantoms, btw (p.117 of Chapter Approved). Femerenden wrote...
Whence all of the Space Marines focuses on protecting the Emperor's ground why our Frost Wraiths are protecting the Vessels(Ground) of the NAVY?They will of course fight the enemy on land as well, but supposedly they specialize in boarding actions. It's like the White Scars, who are known for their attacks on bikes and speeders. That doesn't mean the White Scars can't dismount and fight in a boarding action. Femerenden wrote...
Note: Sorry but i havent come up with a good idea on name; but sooner or later i wiil findone...No need to apologize. A few of us are actually quite happy with the name, I think. Btw, here's a definition of Wraith I found on http://www.dictionary.com; An apparition of a living person that appears as a portent just before that person's death. Sounds pretty good to me. Fitting... Zholud wrote...
I hate this piece for the fact that readers are sure that Lions were right and Inquisitor, for whom it is profession to search for cults and other social cancer, is totally wrong. If anything, you should hate the readers for drawing that conclusion. I think the piece is ok, actually.
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Post by Femerenden on Mar 6, 2004 4:44:21 GMT -5
The myths and the files writen around undeads claim that the air around an undead is chilling there fore colder than 5 meters away.
So our chapter is clearing space hulks and battling on bourding actions mainly.
So what about their organization?( E.g.: Iron hands have lost all of their veterans on Istvaan so they do not have Terminators. But veteran sarges can get Termi Armour as wargear.)
What they prefer in combat?(E.g.: Whitescars prefer lightning swift attacks, Ultramarines prefer fighting just by the book(Codex))
How is their organazation?(E.g.: Iron Hands do not have Chaplains but instaed of it they have Iron Fathers)
So with this we can make it a much clear. The name must be the last thing.
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Post by Minister on Mar 6, 2004 6:05:18 GMT -5
They're a Codex chapter, with perhaps a slight tendency to favour point-blank firefights.
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Post by zholud on Mar 6, 2004 6:21:51 GMT -5
Btw, here's a definition of Wraith I found on http://www.dictionary.com; An apparition of a living person that appears as a portent just before that person's death. I may agree with it, despite ‘classic’ wraith never kills, it is just an omen, so not directly appropriate to Space Marines. The largest objections are still rareness of word, so you automatically cut off some readers, who are lazy to look in dictionary and the sound of it, too unimpressive IMHO. If anything, you should hate the readers for drawing that conclusion. I think the piece is ok, actually. Readers are stuck nly with the scris they are given, and scribs are already very biased in the favour of Marines in almost all GW publications. Note to Kage Do not lock this thread voting yet… after all there are new members with new opinions and our IA author is still off, writing |
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Post by CELS on Mar 6, 2004 9:19:01 GMT -5
Femerenden- Sikkukkut is writing an Index Astartes article on the Space Marines, so I'm afraid only he can answer your questions with some certainty. Unfortunately, he does not have the time to finish it, and is reluctant to post what he has done so far (since it's not finished), so the Space Marines are on hold at the moment. ...which is fine, since they don't really have a huge impact on the sector. I'm still not convinced by the double meaning btw... I would argue against the majority of players not knowing what a 'wraith' is. I think they're pretty common in the fantasy universe... anyone who plays Warhammer FB will probably have heard of them, for example. They are also in the famous (Heroes of) Might and Magic cames.... And they're pretty damned lethal in both Warhammer and Might & Magic... Hhhnnngghh... must... resist.... locking.... poll... must... not... abuse.... powers.... Seriously- more members will be joining all the time. We can't keep opening this for discussion every time a new flock comes in. I say we give it two or three days, at most. |
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Post by zholud on Mar 8, 2004 5:56:49 GMT -5
Who and why locked the voting? Is there any kind of C’tan conspiracy? ;D Or one Inquis is too drunk on power?!  ;D I remind that for last week we get over 10 members, or 12% increase, thus locking is unappropriate, IMNSHO. |
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). Reasons why:
they are as bright as ordinary human with good training in specific disciplines which for sure include strategy and thus planning and probably logic.
;D