|
Post by CELS on Jun 1, 2004 5:40:40 GMT -5
So might it at this stage be appropriate to 'summarise' this thread and put our concept on paper (but not set it in stone) so we have a working idea of what it is exactly? The more things we can more or less agree on, the more new things we can start working on and thus overextend ourselves wonderfully ;D
|
|
|
Post by Kage2020 on Jun 1, 2004 5:52:34 GMT -5
The problem with the Pendulum Tide mechanic is that while it is more than what was originally suggested (i.e. that it existed and mortal man is not meant to know why), it's still fairly tenuous. Admittedly it could be one of those 'meta' features that we provide an answer for but no-one in the universe knows anything about... In which case any writeup would be more one of dominant flows and a history, the flows something that would be represented in both the sector and subsector warp map. Kage
|
|
|
Post by CELS on Jun 1, 2004 6:15:29 GMT -5
Yeah, the summary was just so we had something to work with. Since it seems we largely agree on what the pendulum tide is exactly, it would be great to have a summary that people on the ASP forum could read instead of struggling through the entire thread. So if someone is building a world in the Castellan subsector and is curious about this 'pendulum tide' which is mentioned here and there, we can direct him to a short summary that explains what this is. Plain and simple.
That the Orks and Imperials in the Anargo sector wouldn't know how it worked, is a given. Maybe the Eldar might, and maybe some warp entities (i.e. Daemons) too.
Maybe I should start a sticky 'Summary' thread, which is open only for moderators. We put all our summaries and developed concepts there, sort of like an ASP encyclopedia. Whaddya say?
|
|
|
Post by Destecado on Jun 3, 2004 7:29:27 GMT -5
I've read through a good amount of the article and had some thoughts about how we could describe the Pendulum Tide. Rather than being a ebbing and flowing constant, what if it is something that exists just prior to a Waaagh. It could be similar to a warp tidal wave.
Warp disturbances caused be the Tyranid hive mind are well documented, but why can't such a similar thing for orks exist? This is not to say that the orks have the same effect as the tyranids on warp space. A better way to think of it is when the orks are in agreement on an issue it is not only a physical, but mental force made manifest.
Orks are usually a fractious lot, existing in small groups, bands or tribes. when they join together on a Waaagh, they are all thinking together and working towards a common goal. This creates a gestalt mind between the orks.....they whip themselves into a frenzy and set out to conquor.
Tidal waves in our own oceans maybe created by sudden shifts of techtonic plates or underwater landslides. The orks rallying behind one cause or nob is also a land slide mental shift in their support. This landslide rather than having a physical effect in our own reality is expressed by a pressure wave that preceeds the Waaagh in the warp.
The tide not only disrupts or pushes aside the normal warp patterns in front of them, it also makes travel easier for the orks that follow in its wake. Maybe the tides also effect the "stones" at the Heart of the Sector, which would also impact the Sargasso Gulf.....this may be a way to start tying it all together and create a symbiotic relationship between the various parts of our warp topography.
|
|
|
Post by Kage2020 on Jun 3, 2004 10:44:23 GMT -5
Which is basically how it was originally envisioned as operating. Again, one of the most interesting things about the concept is the fact that you have a 'warp battle' and a 'physical battle' going on simultaneously: one the metaphor for the other. Spirit battles in other words. The point, however, was that at present no Waargh has been able to break through the Castellan 'shield'... But with that said, that's a really interesting way of putting things. I prefer that to previous verions! Kage
|
|
|
Post by CELS on Jun 3, 2004 12:31:55 GMT -5
I thought that was how we already put it. But hey, sounds fine to me, Destecado ;D
Btw, Kage, I do believe that the Castellan subsector has already lost a few worlds to the Ork empire, worlds that are now located in the 'no man's land' between the Castellan sub and the ork empire. But that's something for another thread, I suppose. And I do agree that the Ork waaagh!s have never penetrated the shield of fortress worlds.
|
|
|
Post by Kage2020 on Jun 4, 2004 6:20:11 GMT -5
Well, that's one thread finished with... Mostly! Destecado... Don't suppose you fancy writing something up on this, do you? CELS... Yes, I realise that some of the worlds have fallen, though I belived it was more in terms of infestation (i.e. they're there and the Imperium cannot get rid of the buggers) rather than a complete fall of that world... Kage
|
|
|
Post by Destecado on Jun 4, 2004 6:25:36 GMT -5
Not a problem. If possible can you post a link to the original discussion on portent discussing the Pendulum tide so that I can try to work all of the information into the writeup.
|
|
|
Post by Kage2020 on Jun 4, 2004 7:05:54 GMT -5
There is no link to a thread on Portent... it's all here... Kage
|
|
|
Post by Destecado on Jun 7, 2004 3:06:36 GMT -5
I've been working on the write up for the pendulum tide, but one thing does come to mind....can it really be thought of as a pendulum, if it is more like a tidal warp tidal wave than normal oscillating wave action? Do you think we need to change the name slightly in order to better represent this action? Perhaps the Perilous Tide....
|
|
|
Post by CELS on Jun 7, 2004 3:13:29 GMT -5
It's not really perilous either, is it? I thought it was quite stable. But, considering that it brings the hordes of evil to the shores of mankind, how about a scary name? Like one of the rivers in Hades. One was called Styx.. but that's already used by the Styx class heavy cruiser... Oh well.
|
|
|
Post by Kage2020 on Jun 7, 2004 3:24:45 GMT -5
Do you think we need to change the name slightly in order to better represent this action? Perhaps the Perilous Tide.... I think we should keep the original name. Not only are we more familiar with it, but it does allude to how it originally worked (i.e. it came one way and then went the other way). Kage
|
|
|
Post by Destecado on Jun 7, 2004 9:16:46 GMT -5
I've done a little research for the write up about the Pendulum Tide and have come up with a couple of thoughts that I wanted feedback on. Please let me know what you think of this as a viable explanation of the Pendulum Tide Phenomenon.
The first deals with the developement of the Waagh. In the fluff it indicates that the Techno-Magi of the Adeptus Mechanicus have identified low levels of background psychic energy in the minds of all Orks and Gretchin.
The fluff further states that Once in a generation an Ork leader will emerge who is powerful enough to defeat dominate or unify opposing tribes. His success will draw others in and soon a great Ork Waagh! is underway. Ork Waaaghs are movements on a massive scale; part migration, part jihad as the Orks see new worlds to conquer and fresh races to enslave.
Taking into account the lower psychic nature of the orks and gretching, circling around a central figure (warboss, warlord) the resulting disturbance in warp topography might appear similar to the developement of a tropical depression. As more Orks gather to the cause it would continue to grow in mass until it forms something similar to a hurricane in the warp.
The Waagh exists at the "eye" or focus of this storm. This moble warp storm would level or disrupt any exisiting warp topography in its path. If view from the preceding edge of the phenomenon, it does resemble a tide or wave coming towards the Castellan Sector.
This might be how its name came about (although it is actually a mobile warp storm rather than a wave through the warp). The warp storm would disrupt communication as well as throw ships off course. It may also influence other warp anomallies in the Sector. The orks, would be unaffected by the storm because they are in the eye, which is come and easy to travel.
The power for the storm is derived from the gestalt or unified mind or drive of the orks. This is not the same as the Tyranid Hive Mind. It bears more in common with the mob mind or mob rule. Unlike the normal mob which is only a physical entity, the psychic nature of the orks allow them to manifest this mob mentality as a force that also effects the surrounding warp.
As the Waagh breaks down (do to defeat or no other enemies to fight) the gestalt will disipate as memebrs break away from the mob. the Warp Storm will begin to diminish with the breakup of the mob.
|
|
|
Post by CELS on Jun 7, 2004 23:32:01 GMT -5
Is this your idea? I thought this was what the fluff said.
I think the Waaagh! creates waves in addition to creating the storm. When orks join a Waaagh!, strong warp currents help to bring them all faster and more safely to their destination. Even space hulks and other vessels that are difficult to navigate are caught by these currents, and taken along for the ride...
|
|
|
Post by Kage2020 on Jun 7, 2004 23:42:32 GMT -5
<grin> It is the 'fluff', though just a different way of putting it. One part of the project will be finding new ways of saying things (I do despise it when people just copy and paste text, such as with the "'Fluff' Bible", useful as it was), so we shouldn't worry too much about this... I think that Destecado was trying to justify why it shouldn't be called the Pendulum Tide... Not going to work, though! Kage
|
|