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Post by HighInquisitor on Jun 3, 2004 12:03:58 GMT -5
So here's my concept on the Ice World in the Archaios subsector.
Please, point out any mistakes, or tell me if you disagree on something. I'm open to any suggestions.
The Ice World (I haven't done any thinking on the name yet, I'm open to suggestions)
Statistics: Population: 22 000 000 Cities: 20 (16 on the surface, 4 underwater) World Type: Ice World, Mining World
Government:
The planet is ruled by a Planetary Governor, and his council of Commanders. Each commander is the leader of one of the 20 cities in this planet. In the end, the Governor always has the final word. Planetary Governor is elected by the Commanders, from the ranks of the Commanders. Planetary Governor is elected for life. The Commanders are elected every ten years, by the people in the cities, each city elects it's own leader.
The Planetary Governor has his headquarters in one of the cities, but the govermental district isn't officially a part of the city, so none of the cities can be considered a capital. (Just like Washington DC in the US.) Because the cities are very much isolated, they are actually more like city states, than cities, all with their own regulations, rules and gorvenment.
The Adeptus Mechanicus also has an represantive in the Council, because of the high number of AM people in the planet.
Cities:
As already stated, there are 20 cites on the planet. Of these, 16 are normal cities of approximately 1 375 000 people, some slightly bigger, some slighty smaller. The four underwater cities only have about 2000 people living there each.
The cities, or city-states, are pretty much isolated. There's not much traffic going on between them. They are all built on large underground mineral fields, so they are actually very big mining societys. There is some rivalry between the city states, and the governor allows it as long as it doesn't get out of control. In this way the city states are always trying to out do each other, so their shipments are almost always of satistying size. This also keeps the city-state Commanders occypied in their ever present competition, so none of them have time to think too much about themselves. Because of this there hasn't been any signs of rebellion since the rise of the Genestealer Cult almost 150 years ago. Armed conflicts between the city-states are very rare, and are always very small skirmishes and raids on mineral shipments.
The "surface cities" are for the most part situated underground. Only about ten percent of any given city is above ground.
Half of the planets surface is covered in oceans that are tens of kilometres deep. For the most part they are frozen, but the warm core of the planet keeps the water from freezing right at the bottom. This is where the four underwater colonies are situated. There are about 2000 people living in each of them. They are partly mining colonies, partly research stations.
Industy:
The planet was colonized because of it's rich mineral fields, and most of the people in the planet are either working on the mines or in a business that is somehow involved in the mining business, such as transport services.
The planet is very isolated, and very much self-sufficient. They grow their own food on the planet. Either deep underground in the cities, or if the plants need light, in the domes on top of the cities. They also make their own clothes. Because of the lack of animals on the planet, all the clothes are also made from plants.
There are two space ports on the planet, one in each of the biggest continents on the planet. From here a constant flow of transport ships are taking the minerals mined here to elsewhere in the system. Incoming traffic is almost non-existant. Some things that can't be produced on the planet are sometimes brought here.
Armed Forces:
Because of the peacefull nature of the planet, only a small portion of the population works in the armed forces. The number is about 660 000. Of these, about 68 000 men are in the Imperial Guard.
(This means little more than 3% of the population works in the military. On real earth the number is one percent. I heard that this number is usually about 10% in the imperium. Do you think that there should be less people in the armed forces on this planet? It is a peacefull mining world after all)
About two thousand of the military personel are actually training personel who teach other Imperial Guard regiments in the sector of survival techniques on iceworlds.
There are 22 regiments of three thousand men each on the planet.
Culture:
The people on the planet are peacefull and quiet. Fancy manners and polite speach with lots of complimets, or small-talk doesn't belong on this planet. An outsider might think that the people are either shy or rude, but these kind of manners just simply aren't part of the culture on this planet. Once you get to know the people here, they are really nice people. Just not very outgoing.
Since you can't spend time outside on this planet, the people spend most of their freetime with eachother, in very small groups though. Alcohol is an important part of their culture, but it's not really a social drink, people drink it to get drunk. Because of this threre are lots of homeless drunkards on the lower levels of the cities. Cigarettes are also a nasty habbit of lots of people on the planet. Also, music is a very important part of their culture.
Travel:
There isn't much travel going on between the city-states, other than the constant flow of mineral shipments. But there is still some going on. The planet is full of endless icy wastes and the wind there can get extremely strong. Because of this, the amount of snow on the plains can change many meters during a space of only few days. This means that trains can't be used as transports. The strong winds also prevent any form of flying. So, the people of the world use vehicles of their own creation, a mixture of a ship, a sledge, a snowmobile and a train. They use sails for moving, but also have tracs and engines in case of emergencys. Wind is an unpredictable source of energy so travelling on the planet is very hazardous. (Much like sailing, before steamengines were invented.)
The rise of the Genestealer cult:
The rise of the Genestealer cult happened about 150 years ago. Somehow a genestealer managed to infiltrate one of the city-states. It hid in the lower parts of the city, slowly gaining followers. Over the years it's power grew, unnoticed by everybody. The cult started to pose as a new Imperial Cult, everything went well for the cult, and a fourth generation hybrid was born. It replaced the original leader and the cult took over the city. But the isolated nature of the cities on the planet worked in the advantage of the Imperium. Before the cult took over, somebody managed to warn the other cities. Decisive actions were taken immediately and all the other cities united and attaced the tainted city. The determination of the imperial forces took the cult, who thought that they could take over the whole planet without having to fight, by surprise and the cult was quickly destroyed. The attackers were forced to exterminate everybody from the tainted city. The city is now repaired and repopulated.
There is now always few Ordo Xenos inquisitors on the planet, looking for any sign of a new infestation. The Inquisition would have wanted to destroy the tainted city by bombing it, but the people of the other cities acted before any inquisitorial personel could arrive on the planet, wanting to save at least some of the people from the tainted city. Now nobody can ever know if the whole cult was destroyed or not.
So that's pretty much it. Not a very artistic presentation, I know, but it should do. Any comments? Suggestions?
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Post by CELS on Jun 3, 2004 12:51:48 GMT -5
Alright, HighInquisitor. You're very productive, I'll give you that! ;D I'm afraid I have some important problems that need to be sorted out though... 1) You have to download the guide to develop this world. This world has been given specific statistics that give a rough description of the world's physical and cultural data, including things such as atmosphere and government. You need to use the guide to work out all kinds of important data for this world, such as rotational period (length of day), gravity, temperatures, and so on. An example of the data worked out with the guide can be found here and more specifically here. See? Axial tilt, density, natural resources... You need to use the guide to figure all these things out. 2) It's obvious that you've been inspired by our standard representations, but you haven't followed our example exactly. Well, I'm afraid you're going to have to, though you're free to add to the standard representations, with sections such as the Genestealer cult, which you added. But you need to include everything that the template for the standard representation includes. This is to create a uniform representation of the sector, and is a very important part of the Anargo sector project. Otherwise, some people might choose to leave out physical details, other people might leave out cultural details, and some people might focus on things such as local Imperial Guard regiments, and totally neglect the planets themselves! 3) Language. Ok, we're not exactly expecting academic writing, but a formal tone is preferable. Thus, mentioning stuff such as Washington DC or writing "Much like sailing, before steam engines were invented."... is not great, in my opinion. If you look at the way GW write most of their fluff, that's a good example of what I'm talking about. It's far from an academic writing style, and they don't shy away from inserting the odd joke, but you don't see them writing "The Adeptus Arbites are pretty much Judge Dredd in space" I hope I'm not too harsh with you, and I know that it's difficult to immediately understand the traditions of such a large project as this. What you write does have great potential, and this world could become very interesting, if you just heed my advice and maybe add a few of your own ideas to it. Perhaps there's more to this mining world than meets the eye? Perhaps it's not ONLY covered with lonely mining installations? PS: On percentage of armed forces, we usually work with 1-4% on most Imperial worlds in the Anargo sector. Of course, some worlds have a significantly higher percentage, such as fortress worlds. For a mining world such as this, 3% is good.
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Post by HighInquisitor on Jun 3, 2004 13:00:49 GMT -5
Thanks for the feedback!
I believe there has been a misunderstanding.. on my part. I thought that a concept meant the basic idea, which to discuss on, before actually starting to build the world. So I wrote this to intorduce my ideas to you.
I will gladly follow your rules on this project. I have already downloaded the Guide and I will follow it and fill the standard representations, when I'll start working on the planet.
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Post by CELS on Jun 3, 2004 20:51:54 GMT -5
Oh. *facepalms* Well, I'll comment specifically on your concept then. I just figured you'd skipped the concept stage and gone straight to the standard representation, for some reason... Right, concept.... 1) The title of Imperial Commander is reserved for the "Planetary Governor". Each world is ruled by a Commander, so it gets confusing if you call each regional ruler a Commander. I suggest calling them Regional Governor or something similar. 2) Planetary Governor is elected for life? Is this a democratic process? 3) 20 cities... why so few? And having underwater cities would mean that they would be under the ice. It's not impossible, of course, but it does complicate things. Like when they want to get the minerals and crystals to the surface.... 4) Why is there rivalry between the cities? Do they get paid by the Planetary Governor for their shipments? 5) Why are the oceans so deep? The oceans of earth are 11 km's at the very deepest, right? Off the coast of Japan, I believe, where two tectonic plates are diverging. On the rest of the planet however, it is far more shallow (or less deep). Why so extreme differences in depth and altitude on this planet? 6) Perhaps we should include something about production of food and clothes taking up a lot of space, to explain why so few Imperial worlds are totally self-sufficient. 7) I like what you wrote on the Genestealer cult. Maybe put more emphasis on the fact that the Inquisition is still monitoring the city, with undercover agents checking for signs of corruption and infestation.
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Post by HighInquisitor on Jun 4, 2004 2:21:15 GMT -5
You bring up some very good points.
1) Thanks for clearing that up. The ruler of the planet shall be called Imperial Commander from now on, and the city-state leaders shall be called Regional Governors for now.
2) Yes. The Regional Governors choose the Commander from their own ranks. So the people get to choose the Regional Governors, who the choose the Commander. I thought that it would be too democratic if the people got to vote on the Commander, or if he stayed in office only for few years. This is Imperium after all. This can be changed though, I just thought that this would be a cool way to handle it. And the Guide says "represantive democracy", or something of the same effect.
3) The number of the cities is in no way set in stone. I just think that it makes the isolated nature of the cities stand out even more if there isn't so many of them. I'm open to suggestion though (as always).
The underwater cities are a bit problematic matter, but I think it's a really cool concept, so I'm willing to try. The way I see it is like this: The cities aren't very far from the coast. There is a tunnel for transporting the shipments. The tunnel can't go through ice, because it would get crushed. Instead it travels on the bottom of the sea, until it gets underground, and then it just rises to the surface. There's a small outpost on the surface, with twenty or so people living there, making sure that everything's alright with the tunnel and handing the shipments to the caravans who come to get them.
4) A good question. The way I see it, the Commander distributes the money made from the shipments to the cities. The bigger your shipment, more money you get. The commander has two main jobs, to ensure that proper tithes are paid to the Imperium, and that none of the cities get significantly stronger than the others. As the size of the shipment increases, the costs of producing it also usually increase.
5) Okay, this was a mistake on my part. It seemed like a cool idea, but now that I think of it, it doesn't make any sense. This planet is smaller than earth, so I suppose the oceans are few kilometres deep. Besides, you can still get a pretty claustrophobic atmosphere when there's no natural sunlight... (Because of the ice.)
6) Sounds like a good idea, I'll start working on it.
7) Thanks. I will.
So that's all for the moment. I have some more ideas to discuss with you, but unfortunately I don't have the time to write them at the moment. I'll get back to it later.
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Post by CELS on Jun 4, 2004 4:18:40 GMT -5
Good stuff. Looking forward to hearing about your other ideas for the planet, since the concept is somewhat shallow/simple at the moment On cities, I wanted the planet to be sparsely populated, but not to the degree you suggested. Consider how many cities there are on earth with a population of 500,000 citizens. Well, mining installations would be just as common as that, except that they'd have a far smaller population and be far smaller in size, with the entire population living in a single installation instead of being spread across the land. In other words, I guess there would be thousands, or maybe tens of thousands of installations/cities, but most of the planet would still be entirely desolate, since all installations are quite small, and only barely showing above ground. The way I had pictured the planet, an average population for a mining installation would be thousands of citizens. Of course, there would be some large settlements, such as the city where the planet's Commander and the Adeptus Terra conclave is located, surveying the planet and doing various administrative work. There would also be a large number of low tech space ports, since the infrastructure is too weak for all cities to transport their products to a single location on the planet.
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Post by HighInquisitor on Jun 4, 2004 13:02:58 GMT -5
Alright, thousands of cities it is then. Now that I think of it, it's actually a really good idea. But it means that some adjustments have to be done, regarding the government. Maybe the planet is divided into provinces who all choose a represantive to the council? That also means that the population of the underwater cities should be reduced to few hundreds of people, which is actually, much better idea in my opinion. I would still like to keep the number of underwater cities very low, four sound good to me.
Here's another idea. There's a certain characteristic flaw in the people of this planet. They are nice people, peacful and quiet. But they are slightly obsessed in remaining peaceful and quiet. Over the centuries they have grown to love their harsh planet, and to enjoy the calm atmosphere. They want everything to stay as it is, but it is the nature of things to move on and change. The people have become somewhat ignorant of some alarming signs that have been around for some time.
Two years ago, a disaster almost occured in one of the underwater cities. While digging deeper and deeper onto the ground, they hit a large previously unnoticed gaspocket, which exploded and started a chainreaction of seismic activity which finally culminated in the creation of a huge rift in the bottom of the sea. The rift is several kilometers long, and there is a constant flow of hot steam coming from somewhere within the rift. It soon started to warm the water and within few months of time, it melted the ice above it, thus creating the first and only place on the planet where the seawater isn't frozen. By sheer luck, the underwater city wasn't damaged, and it actually became one of the most beautiful places on the planet, as dim rays of sun now light the bottom of the ocean.
This incident proves the fact that you can only dig so much. But for the most part, the people of the planet ignore this, and the pleas of taking precautions against similar incidents. Severe geological damage could be inflicted if such events would happen again. Many offworlders and some more openminded citizens of the planet feel that they are sitting on a geological timebomb and nothing is being done...
Another example of this attitude is ignoring the threat of another rising of the Genestealer cult. The people of the planet don't like remembering those times. They feel ashamed of the fact that the peaceful nature of their home was disturbed. They like to think that nothing bad ever happens here. And when they talk of those times, they only remember the heroic actions of destroying the threat.
This has proven to be a real problem for the inquisitorial forces stationed on the planet. The local autohorities seem unwilling to help them and refuse to believe that there is a chance of another uprising. This makes getting help from the locals really hard, and the inquisitors often feel that they are chasing nothing but ghosts and shadows. Yet there's always the feeling that not everything is as it seems...
So what do you think?
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Post by CELS on Jun 5, 2004 0:07:58 GMT -5
Alright, thousands of cities it is then. Now that I think of it, it's actually a really good idea. But it means that some adjustments have to be done, regarding the government. Maybe the planet is divided into provinces who all choose a represantive to the council? Hmm... how about we try something new that hasn't been done for any other worlds in the Anargo sector so far, to my knowledge. Instead of provinces, make it companies. Interstellar corporations, run from Anargo, Meksum and other big and important worlds. Each company has it's own executive that adminstrates his company's installations. The Imperial Commander of the world... hmmm... he could be the descendant of the rogue trader that originally colonized the world. How about if way in the past, a rogue trader found this uninhabited ice ball, made some scans which revealed that it was rich with minerals far, far under ground, and claimed it as his own. He then sold territories to corporations from Meksum and Anargo, who started building the mining installations. Fine by me In my opinion, this doesn't make sense. Being peaceful and quiet, I can see why they would ignore stuff such as cults, rebellions, disease and so on. But I don't see them ignoring the crust of the planet being torn up or a meteor the size of Mexico coming down on their heads. But... working on the assumption that the installations are owned by large corporations, perhaps the executives are the ones that are ignoring this alarming signs, because they want the profit for their companies. Most of the population (workers) don't know anything about it, so they're peaceful and quiet as always. The scientists who are trying to get the word out, trying to warn the other workers, are silenced by the companies. They fall down elevator shafts and slip on the toilet and break their neck This is cool, but would make even more sense with the interstellar corporations. Fearful of the Inquisition coming to shut down their business, the companies are concerned that this will reduce their profit. Thus, they try to deal with the problem themselves, without alerting Imperial authorities....
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Post by HighInquisitor on Jun 5, 2004 0:29:53 GMT -5
I actually thought of that earlier. I just thought that this kind of corporative control wasn't appropriate in this universe. But if you think that it could be done, it would be a perfect idea. It would also explain the rivalry between the cities even more.
My idea was that the geological problems were just starting to build up. Just like the warming of the atmosphere on real earth. The signs are there, but not much is done about it. Few years ago, the problem was almost completely ignored. But I agree, this too, would be better with the corporations.
But what about the Guide? I'm not at home at the moment so I don't have acces to it. So would it be allright to have these corporations? We need to think a way that this would still be a system of represantive democratics. But I don't see corporations holding elections about who's the new CEO. Hopefully this is something we can overcome, because the idea of corporations is way too nice to pass.
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Post by CELS on Jun 5, 2004 0:44:52 GMT -5
I actually thought of that earlier. I just thought that this kind of corporative control wasn't appropriate in this universe. But if you think that it could be done, it would be a perfect idea. It would also explain the rivalry between the cities even more. And here I was, thinking I was being clever... ;D It is appropriate, but not common. We have to be careful too, because we still have to make it consistent with fluff. The corporations won't have full control of the planet, since there is still an Imperial presence here, the Adeptus Terra. There also has to be an Imperial Commander, for whom I suggested the descendants of the rogue trader. Excellent. The Guide is just that- a guide, as Kage has said on several occassions. Generally, people are not allowed to mess with physical data, since that is done on the cost of realism, but social data such as government, law level, population and local customs can easily be changed by the designer. In other words, we can change the government for this world from representative democracy to corporate rule, but we can't change the size of the world, the atmosphere, etc.
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Post by HighInquisitor on Jun 6, 2004 8:29:07 GMT -5
I got some question before I continue.
First of all, the corporations. They are from all around the Anargo Sector of course, and since they are big enough to control regions in this world, they must also have some impact on the systems that they are from. So, what should I do about them, can I just invent my own or should consult somebody else? To my knowledge (which is very limited, since I'm a new member) there isn't any corporations already made, right?
I thought that I should start writing about the different social "classes" on the planet next, so this is pretty important.
Second question... naming. I'm getting fed up with calling this place the ice planet. So I thought that I should invent a working name for this planet. So are there any limitations with naming? Are there any coherency issues that I should be aware of? For example, all the subsector names (exept Meksum) seem to be in latin (I think). Anything like that with planet names?
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Post by CELS on Jun 6, 2004 9:00:42 GMT -5
I got some question before I continue. First of all, the corporations. They are from all around the Anargo Sector of course, and since they are big enough to control regions in this world, they must also have some impact on the systems that they are from. So, what should I do about them, can I just invent my own or should consult somebody else? To my knowledge (which is very limited, since I'm a new member) there isn't any corporations already made, right? Good point. No corporations are already made (except Sabryan, but they are unlikely to deal in mining), so you'll most likely have to invent new ones. I suggest that you PM the owners of Anargo (Kage), Meksum (Zholud), Maeros (Raider), Dorvastor and Toshanden (Minister), and Archaios (myself) to start a discussion about ideas for corporations that might come from their worlds. They might have specific ideas about such corporations, or might not want any such corporations on their world at all. I don't think any other worlds are suitable for having large inter-sub corporations, but feel free to ask other members too. With the exception of the 'nobles' and members of the Adeptus Terra , I suppose most people on this world will be workers, so social class will depend on their pay check, but I'm looking forward to read about this. Ah, good! And good question! No, there's no limitation for naming, really. Well, there's common sense, so you can't call your world anything silly or give it five names, but you don't have to follow any rules. And by the way, I believe the only subsector name in latin is Castellan So make any suggestion you'd like, and unless I've got good reason, it's accepted. Then, when you've finished the standard representation some time in the future, you can post it in a new thread with the name of your planet, so that people can easily find the S.R. without having to search through many pages about conceptual discussion
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Post by HighInquisitor on Jun 6, 2004 11:16:18 GMT -5
Even though the nature of the planet is merciless, it is also very, very beautiful. Especially if you can watch it behind the wide glass domes found in the spacious homes of the upper class, situated on the top of the cities. In these warm and nicely decorated massive appartments, the well-to-do of the planet have their expensive dinners and relaxed parties, enjoying fine and expensive wines and the insanely beautiful sunsets of the planet. The planet is a perfect place for peaceful, quiet and luxury filled lives, if you happen to be very rich. Here the descendants of the Rogue Trader, the high ranked corporation representatives, the high ranked Ecclessiarchy members and the highest Adeptus Terra officials live and work. They rarely leave their homes, prefering to have everything brought to them.
If you descend under the surface, you enter a zone of orderly madness. Here the massive masses of clerks, corporation officials, priests, scientists and more wealthier merchants go around quietly hurrying and doing their everyday business. These areas are clean and well maintained. The inhabitants of these areas are quietly happy with their lives and relatively good quality of living here. Visiting the surface is common for them.
If venturing even further down, you can notice the level of noise and warmth slowly rising. The people here are more dirty and are dressed badly. The majority of the people in the lower class are mine workers. They work all day long in the hot and noisy pits, digging deeper and deeper onto the depths of the planet. After their long days of work they get home to enjoy the company of their friends -and more often than not, some very strong alcoholic beverages. The crime rates are highest here, and there are lots of rejects of the society, homeless drunkards and other such people living on the lower reaches of the city. It is not uncommon at all for somebody from the lower class to live their whole lives underground, never seeing the sky. Because of this the people of the lower class are naturally very pale. But you can rarely notice this, since they are alway covered in dirt and their faces are baked in the constant heat of the great forges that they work with. Despite their hard lives they are generally very satisfied with their lives, and it is true that they seem a lot more lively than the people of the middle class.
Even though it is a good rule of thumb, that the higher up a person lives, the wealthier he is, there are many notable exeptions. For example, the people who make their living by travelling from city to city with their sledge-ships, all live on the surface, usually isolated from the nobility though. The barracks are usually on the surface too.
Another thing worth noting is that the people of the different classes don't live so much apart from each other as I might have made you think. There are no clear border lines between the districts of the poor and the middle class, for example.
The underwater cities are a different thing alltogether. There isn't any lower class there. Even though there is some mining going around there, it is more specialised, relying more on machines and highly trained personel. A large portion of the people in the underwater cities are scientists. To live in one of the underwater cities you must go through a strict selection progress.
That's all for now.
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Post by KeirLeslie on Jun 6, 2004 11:33:32 GMT -5
Hello, High Inquisitor. I'm working on a world, Trilla, in the Dorvastor subsector that is run by corporations. Now, Trilla is an Agriworld and the corporations are more like the Italian Merchant Houses so I don't think that there will be too much overlap but I'm just telling you now so we don't end up with identical worlds. I think that if you keep a more modern feel to them and I'll have a very old fashioned style it'll be fine.
For elections how about the idea of being paid in shares and voting with those shares. I mean obviously there is no stockmarket or anything like that, but the more you own the more your vote is worth? The execs would own more so their vote is worth more. The worker wouldn't own enough to make a difference really so it wouldn't be too democratic.
Anyway I really like the Iceworld idea.
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Post by HighInquisitor on Jun 13, 2004 9:57:37 GMT -5
Thanks for telling me, I'll keep that in mind.
I have to think about that, I've grown quite fond of the idea of ripping millions of people of their freedom... I'll keep that in mind too.
I apogolize for not doing any work for the project for almost a week, I've been off airsofting. Unfortunately I'm going to leave on a vacation to Paris two days from now. I will be back in a week, and then I'm going to redouble my efforts for the project.
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