|
Post by Recoil on May 25, 2004 20:09:32 GMT -5
Thank you Cels... I really like what this Forum does to the fluff..... The Orks are an ancient race. They've fought the Eldar and other races for millennia too, and the Eldars have Titans and much more powerful weapons than humans. Besides, building ballistic weapons such as bolters and autoguns is ork nature, and easier to create than energy weapons and shuriken weapons. I understand you ... but I always had problems with the image of Orks popping up on some planets and starting building guns and buggies from scratch.... I disagree. On Vangelis (the setting of GorkaMorka), the Orks were more advanced than the humans, and developed a high technology despite being totally isolated. Furthermore, Ork nature drives them to advance technology, since the orks compete for domination and thus need the bigger, better guns and machines and eventually industry. Understood... but in case of Vangelis... noone knows if the Orks had contact with other races or more advanced Orks before they crashed on that planet.... Sounds sneaky. I'm not sure if that fits with the current image of the Orks. Conquering is more orky, after all. Only cowards and panzies avoid a good fight That's right... I just though that it would prove that Orks are able of more than conquering and destroying thinks. Recoil
|
|
|
Post by CELS on May 25, 2004 20:58:39 GMT -5
Thank you Cels... I really like what this Forum does to the fluff..... Glad to hear that. Hope to see you post in other Ork threads as well as other forums within the project I understand you ... but I always had problems with the image of Orks popping up on some planets and starting building guns and buggies from scratch.... Yes, that I can understand and agree with. But I do think that because of the nature of the mekboys, an isolated tribe would reach a high tech level in short times compared to humans, maybe reach space travel tech in only centuries. Anyway, I agree that most new ork infestations are hugely affected by the surrounding civilisations, be they Eldar or humans, but I would argue that orks are in no way dependent on either race to develop tech such as battle tanks, bolters, powered armour, etc. Understood... but in case of Vangelis... noone knows if the Orks had contact with other races or more advanced Orks before they crashed on that planet.... It's not the best example, I agree. That's right... I just though that it would prove that Orks are able of more than conquering and destroying thinks. An important point, since it's easy to underestimate the single-mindedness of the orks. Still the ork concept of honour goes makes it difficult to reach diplomatic solutions, with the Blood Axe clan being a possible exception.
|
|
|
Post by Minister on May 26, 2004 0:18:48 GMT -5
With the Blood Axes having a bit less dificulty, rather than none. They still have the see it - hit it mentality, but they are more likley to supress it for long-term gain.
|
|
|
Post by Lordof on May 26, 2004 2:07:04 GMT -5
Well no not so much as surpress it but actually grasp that working together at times helps you get more than if you beat them up and take whats left.
|
|
|
Post by malika on May 26, 2004 2:22:36 GMT -5
Glad to hear that. Hope to see you post in other Ork threads as well as other forums within the project Yes, that I can understand and agree with. But I do think that because of the nature of the mekboys, an isolated tribe would reach a high tech level in short times compared to humans, maybe reach space travel tech in only centuries. Anyway, I agree that most new ork infestations are hugely affected by the surrounding civilisations, be they Eldar or humans, but I would argue that orks are in no way dependent on either race to develop tech such as battle tanks, bolters, powered armour, etc. It's not the best example, I agree. First of all the planet is called Angelis. Secondly, because of the crash the Orks became mutated, causing a unusual high number of Meks to be there. And Meks are the "scientist/engineers" of Ork society, so it's understandable that the Orks on Angelis might be more "technologically advanced" Another reason might that they can't leave the planet, so the meks try to create a way for them to leave the planet and join the Great Waaagh.
|
|
|
Post by CELS on May 26, 2004 2:25:58 GMT -5
First of all the planet is called Angelis. I bow my head in bottomless shame Secondly, because of the crash the Orks became mutated, causing a unusual high number of Meks to be there. Like I said, I agree it's not the best example...
|
|
|
Post by Minister on May 27, 2004 0:45:08 GMT -5
The Imperium calls the planet Angelis. This is the Ork forum, therefore it is called GorkaMorka, which is the Ork name for the planet (technically, most of the just call it Da World or simmilar).
I'm not sure that the Meks' numbers were that much increased, but their position within society certainly changed.
|
|
|
Post by Lordof on May 27, 2004 1:44:19 GMT -5
Well the Orks certainly turned more into a cult of speed force with buggies and high speed being the two main ingrediants of most these guys lives.
Meks may not have increased in number but i think the orks overall understanding of tech would have increased due to them having to do fairly constant repairs on trukks and traks.
So my arguement here is that the number of meks may not have gone up but the general orky population understood how things worked a lot better.
|
|
|
Post by Recoil on May 27, 2004 2:31:37 GMT -5
So then it is true that Orks have the knowledge about the technology in their genes and can basically manufacture anything? Or are they fixed to a distinctive technology level?
I mean, why don't they built weapons which are much better then those of other races?
And on the other hand, if they are fixed to a technology level, then I think the Brainboyz were not so smart, because sooner or later the Orks were not able to beat more sophisticated races which have better guns and better equipment!
So far the Orks have basically the same equipement as the average Imperial Guard.... why is this so? I think the normal way would be that the Orks would try to come up with better weapons and equipment.... but this seems to be not the matter.
Oh.. and sorry if my english sound a little bit weird.. its not my native language!!!
Recoil
|
|
|
Post by Sikkukkut on May 27, 2004 3:16:38 GMT -5
So then it is true that Orks have the knowledge about the technology in their genes and can basically manufacture anything? Or are they fixed to a distinctive technology level? IIRC the Brainboyz built what knowledge they could into the Orks because they themselves were dying out and this was their last stab at giving their warrior sub-race a crack at survival. I'd say they had no time to prefect the process by which the orks were programmed.
|
|
|
Post by Sojourner on May 27, 2004 8:07:44 GMT -5
Or alternatively, the genes simply stimulate the Ork to vauge ideas and relies on his own intelligence to actually make things happen. It's not like they have blueprints and flowcharts in there, just a half-remembered image of this thing with wheels, steering and engine and have a stab at building one.
|
|
|
Post by Lordof on May 27, 2004 14:50:53 GMT -5
Yeah the Ork mekboyz are mekboyz because they have a better understanding of how bits go together to make something that works.
Also Orks being mildly psycic also helps with them beleiving in that something should work strongly enough actually makes it work.
|
|
|
Post by Kage2020 on May 28, 2004 6:29:35 GMT -5
Does anyone have a solid 'real world' fact about genetic knowledge beyond instinct-level activity? Just for me...? Destecado? Kage
|
|
|
Post by Sojourner on May 28, 2004 20:34:09 GMT -5
Treat it like instincts present in any other animal. You'd need a psychologist to explain the process, but can you at least accept that it's plausible when you look at real-world examples?
|
|
|
Post by Kage2020 on May 29, 2004 8:22:17 GMT -5
Instinct-level activity was the exception to the rule... I'm after solid facts that complex information can be exchanged genetically. Of course, you've got grabs on what 'complex' means there, but heck nothing is ever easy... I just need to see that there is something that gives credence to the concept - out of interest! - other than "GW says so". ( Note that "out of interest" bit again... ) Kage
|
|