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Post by Kage2020 on Apr 3, 2004 10:46:07 GMT -5
I'm intrigued. How applicable would you believe that some - not all! - of the imagery and concepts from Final Fantasy: The Sprits Within (a very pretty film if you can say nothing else about it) be for the eldar? That 'bioetheric energy' just smacks of the kind of power generated by wraithbone (or whatever, depends on how you view wraithbone operating) and the holographic/virtuality interface technology might be applicable also... Just a quick thought after watching the majority of the film while trying to write about the history of a rather tedious city in England... Kage
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Post by Destecado on Apr 12, 2004 13:39:18 GMT -5
Well if you consider the exodite World Spirits, it is definitely plausable.
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Post by CELS on Apr 13, 2004 3:09:12 GMT -5
I don't really remember that movie too well, except that it was indeed pretty ;D
What imagery and concepts exactly are you trying to apply to the Eldar? Maybe I'll remember something if you mention it.
I don't remember a lot, really... There was some sort of plague or alien race on Earth, and the characters used Gaia as a weapon (it had five living creatures that could be combined, IIRC) or something. Gaia was the life force of Earth?
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Post by Kage2020 on Apr 13, 2004 8:19:54 GMT -5
I wasn't particularly thinking of the 'world spirit' idea since I do not see the 'ancestor storage' used by the Exodites as being definitively different to that used by the craftworld eldar... the trappings are different, but the technology is fundamental the same. It's just the easiest answer rather than inventing something new... So, it wasn't the Gaia thing, but rather the approach to technology and energy production. Then again I don't know what I was thinking. It was a mid-afternoon thought by means of a break from doing work! Guess I'm still trying to figure out where eldar get their energy from. I've always seen it as being the wraithbone, but that could have been an erroneous assumption. Kage
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Post by Destecado on Apr 19, 2004 16:27:38 GMT -5
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Post by Kage2020 on Apr 19, 2004 16:39:04 GMT -5
Thanks for the links. The Gaia 'idea', however, is something that only manifests itself through the "undifferentiated spirits" of the Infinity Circuit. This is basically a similar principle to the 'habitat consciousness' of the Edenists from Peter F. Hamilton's "Confederation" (as found in books such as the Night's Dawn trilogy). I'm still intrigued as to a consistent theory of eldar power generation, however. Once again I've always previously worked on the idea that eldar power was derived from wraithbone but... well, people seem to disagree. Solar energy doesn't work (although that doesn't mean it isn't employed) and nuclear methods seems a bit brute for them... (Eldar power generation, for me, is basically a "Cosmic Power Plant" created from rather specific types of wraithbone. Specific volumes of wraithbone generating specific amounts of energy: the more energy, the more is required. However, because of the nature of wraithbone it is best to keep the systems diffuse throughout the structure...) Hmmn... might not be the best thread for this, but there we go... Kage
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Post by Destecado on Apr 19, 2004 17:05:22 GMT -5
Actually the thought of Wraithbone acting like an extremely dense capacitor has always stuck in my mind. I'm trying to locate a paper that I once read about creating electricity for orbiting space stations by dragging a cable through the atmosphere. this would build up both heat and a static charge which could be converted to power. Similarly, craft worlds have a large webway portal directly at the rear of their ships. There must be some friction or drag that occurs at the egress or event hirozon of the portal. Instead of being discharged into space, what if this was absorped by the wraithbone of the craft world. It would be an unlimitted power supply.....I'll try to locate the article and post a link. This is also why it is able to house the spiritual energy of the dead eldar, It acts as a capacitor for the infinity circuit. Spirits after all can be described as another energy form. If a C'tan derives the same nourisment from devouring a spirit as it did from nuclear fusion in a star, is it not safe to assume that if wraithbone is an ultra dense capacitor, it should be able to stor the spirit energy of dead eldar as well as act as a power source for eldar equipment? Here are a couple of links to information regarding Electrodynamic Tethers. The first deals with bodies in orbit around a planet and the interaaction with the magnetic field of the planet. The provides the mathmatics behind it as well as using tethers as a means for locamotion. www.tethers.com/EDTethers.htmlwww-ccar.colorado.edu/asen5050/projects/projects_2001/eby/introduction.htmlI'm not sure what type of magnetic field the portals into the webway may exert. Does it give off a magnetic field or resonance of any kind. Have you ever wonder what makes the warp gate stay directly at the rear of the craft world as it moves through space? Instead of actual physical tethers, perhaps they are replaced with energy fields.
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Post by Kage2020 on Apr 19, 2004 17:15:44 GMT -5
I don't think that I would go with a dominant source of energy being the 'portal dragging', especially since I don't really envisage the eldar craftworlds to be travelling at a significant fraction of c to generate that much energy (required to increase the relative density of the interstellar medium)... That wraithbone is a capacitor is part of the 'fluff' (i.e. the original 'fluff' on psychoplastics, WD127; check out CH for the original article) but that energy is sustained by the conneciton to the warp so it would seem reasonable to extend that to limited power generation, though not on the 'singularity/sink' image of the "spirit engine"... Kage
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Post by Destecado on Apr 19, 2004 17:25:01 GMT -5
The craftworld need not be traveling at any great rate of speed, it is its interaction with the webway that is important......that actually gives me an interesting thought. what if the energy is derived from the warp, but not directly. what if the web way itself is the tether (s) being dragged through warp space. I know that they are seperate from warp space, but still exist within it.
The "drag" created by the webway builds up enormous amounts of energy which can be transferred through the portal to the craftworld. The craftworld acts as a capacitor or "sink" to draw off this energy and store it. The warp can therefore indirectly be said to power wraithbone. What do you think?
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Post by Minister on Apr 19, 2004 18:08:22 GMT -5
To one whose opinion of the Eldar is usualy "Filthy Xenos Witches", it sounds quite good...
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Post by Kage2020 on Apr 19, 2004 20:02:16 GMT -5
The "drag" created by the webway builds up enormous amounts of energy which can be transferred through the portal to the craftworld. The craftworld acts as a capacitor or "sink" to draw off this energy and store it. The warp can therefore indirectly be said to power wraithbone. What do you think? Good answer. Implication = any vessel capable of generating (or which has attached) a Webway portal can generate energy. Result = any vessel which is capable of moving through Webway is capable of such generation..? Kage
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Post by Minister on Apr 20, 2004 3:49:15 GMT -5
I am reminded of the Hyperspace Tap here...
Aha! Shpleeendid! We have here a reason why the smaller Eldar ships do not use a full Gravitic drive: energy generation! It works! And it fits the Eldar fluff perfectly!
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Post by CELS on Apr 20, 2004 6:41:44 GMT -5
Fantastic! Now, if you could just explain it to us mortals who do not know what gravitic drives are.....
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Post by Minister on Apr 20, 2004 9:10:42 GMT -5
Simply: a form of reactionless thrusters, and my prefered propulsion form for the Eldar.
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Post by Kage2020 on Apr 20, 2004 13:23:59 GMT -5
You're right, it does solve the problem... but I hate it. At present is strikes me as far too chicken and egg. Admittedly I don't have a better solution, but then again I don't really see the problem of having both 'capital' and 'sub-capital' ships with reactionless thrusters. Kage
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