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Post by Kage2020 on Oct 27, 2004 15:24:59 GMT -5
One thing that has prevented a full integration of wargame and RPG is, to be fair, my own lack of knowledge of the current BFG game. While I have vague recollections of Space Fleet (as it was named then) and the more detailed rules presented in WD139+, it is still all a bit hazy. Anyway, from memory I recall it being rather simple – but fun because of it! – and I happen to have found some RPG rules which are as simple as they get for RPG (beyond narrative determination). The system is meant to be fairly ‘realistic’, so I will leave you experienced wargamers to make that determination. Overall this would greatly help me out as token (and single) roleplayer on the board, but also provide a framework by which the more complex RPG by consistently and appropriately integrated into the ASP background. Please note that I’m not trying to suggest that this system is used, only that it provides an ideal means of integrating BFG and the more detailed RPG as well as refining the latter so that it is more consistent with the wargame (as far as possible given the relative differences in detail involved).
Only FTL ships are likely to meet and fight in deep space. But ships of any kind, moving on manoeuvre drive, can context the strategic area around a planet or jump pint. The combat system presented here is intended to maximise the involvement of individual PCs (and, of course, significant NPCs). It gives many different skills the chance to be decisive in battle. Two types of damage are represented her: personal injury to important characters, and specific damage to the PCs’ ship or ships. SpacecraftTo use this combat system, a few general pieces of information are needed for each ship. First, the GM should decide on the approximate volume of each ship in cubic years (cy), using these guidelines: - Fighter: 5-500 cy
- Corvette: 1,000-3,000 cy
- Destroyer: 15,000-20,000 cy
- Cruiser: 50,000-75,000 cy
- Battleship: 100,000-150,000 cy
- Dreadnought: 200,000-300,000 cy
Please note that these are the values assumed in the system. Obviously BFG values are much, much larger than these.Next, decide which ship is the fastest. Finally, determine Defence Factor (DF) and Firepower (FP) for each spacecraft. These quantities are defined in greater detail in GURPS Space. If the DF and FP of a spacecraft are unknown, or if the GM wnts to keep things deliberately abstract, the following general guidelines can be used. Defence Factor (DF)This number abstracts the defensive capabilities of the ship. Armour, force fields and stealth all constitute DF. (See Computing Attacks for other factors.) DF from multiple sources is additive. To decide on how much DF a vessel will need, use the following rule of thumb at TL8: non-combatant ships require DF1-3; fighters, DF2-4; light warships (destroyers, corvettes, etc.), DF4-6; and ships-of-the-line (anything cruiser-sized or larger), DF10+. Add +1 to these figures at TL9, or +2 at TL10; add an extra +2 per TL after 10. Finally, add 50% to the result for slower or heavier warships (carriers, heavy cruisers, etc.) that are expected to suffer concentrated attacks. Armour (TL7; see GURPS Space 78): Minimum DF is `, and DF from arour rarely exceeds 7 or 8. Note the larger ships can mount more armour; DF may be as high as 9 for destroyers and cruisers, and 10 for dreadnoughts and battlecruisers. Force Fields (TL11; see GURPS Space 79): As per armour, except that since forcefield generators are somewhat lighter, a force field DF of 9 or more is not impossible for a large warship. Stealth (TL7; see GURPS Space 89): Against foes of equal or lower TL, a stealth suite can provide DF 1-6, depending on quality. Pirates may be able to afford DF1-2 systems, while cutting edge ships might have DF 6 stealth. It is most efficient for armour, force fields and stealth to provide DF in equal parts; excessively high D from a single source would result in an unrealistically massive and expensive craft. Example: A scenario calls for a generic “TL11 heavy cruiser”. Since the GM cannot find his copy of GURPS Space, he uses the guidelines above. The ship should have a base DF of 10 (it’s a ship-of-the-line), raised to 14 for its TL, then increased by a further 50% for being a heavy cruiser, for a total DF of 21. The GM decides that DF6 is due to its advanced stealth suite, DF 8 is due to its armour and DF 7 to its force fields. GURPS Vehicles and DF: If the spaceship’s Vehicles stats are known, use the following method to determine DF: Armour: Convert DR to DF using the following table DF | DR | DF | DR | DF | DR | under 7 | 0 | 280-559 | 3 | 2,240-4,479 | 6 | 70-139 | 1 | 560-1,119 | 4 | 4,480-8,959 | 7 | 140-279 | 2 | 1,120-2,239 | 5 | etc. | etc. |
Force Fields: If a ship has deflectors, add 1 to DF. If it has force screens, calculate DF based on screen DR separately, then add it to total DF. Stealth: Add 1 for the basic version or 2 for the radical version of each of the following system: stealth, IR cloaking, emission cloaking. Firepower (FP)This number abstracts the offensive capabilities of the ship. See GURPS Space 86 for the FP values of specific weapons, if the ship’s precise armaments are known. This system assumes that they aren’t. To estimate a ship’s firepower, look at its role: An undergunned ship with a long range or a lot of cargo capacity (like a merchant or carrier) cannot seriously harm an equivalent ship, and mounts weapons for defensive purposes only; assign it a FP equal to 5-20 times its DF. A warship, relying on supply ships for fuel and ammo, and built to patrol as well as fight, should be able to engage ships equivalent to itself; it should have FP equal to 20-100 times its DF. An up-gunned ship, like an orbital space fortress, with no need for mobility and designed solely for combat, might have FP equal to 50-500 times its DF. Use the low end of each range for older or lighter craft, or those designed purely for point defence. Use the high end for war-like cultures, or those that have been on a war footing for some time. Use the middle of the range for everyone else. The exact composition of the ship’s armaments is left up to the GM; be creative! There are two exceptions: First, a specific number of FP 3-5 “point defence” weapons should be designed to shoot down missiles (see Point Defence Gunnery[/u], below). Second, if the ship carries missiles, decide how much of the ship’s FP is due to guns, then multiple what’s left by 1.5 for conventional missiles, 5 for nuclear missiles or 15 for antimatter missiles (TL11+). This “missile FP” represents expendable missiles, and should be divided up between a specific number of missiles; conventional missiles may have FP 1-10, atomic missiles FP 20-100 and antimatter missiles FP 200-1,000. The captain of each ship may expect as many or as few missiles as he wishes each combat round; but once they’re gone, they’re gone! (Other weapons can fire every combat round.) Note that atomic and antimatter weapons are actually much more effective than the multipliers indicate, but they’re also expensive, so fewer missiles are carried. Example: The cruiser above has a DF 21. The GM decides it is a typical warship, and gives it a mid-range FP of 60 times its DF, or FP 1,260. The GM describes this as two main batteries of three heavy particle beams, two secondary batteries of three medium particle beams, and a dozen small (FP 5) lasers for point defence. If the cruiser were a missile cruiser, it might only have FP 360 from guns (described as point defence weapons and light gun batteries); the remaining 900 would be multiplied by 15 (for TL11 antimatter missiles) to get FP 13,500 in missiles. The GM decides that this represents three FP 1000 “heavy” missiles, a dozen FP 600 “medium” ones and twenty FP 165 “light” ones. GURPS Vehicles and FP: If the vessel’s Vehicles stats are known, FP can be estimated more precisely as follows: FP is based on the dice of damage the weapon inflicts. Only weapons that can function in vacuum can be used for space combat. FP is equal to dice of damage/100 for guns and non-nuclear missiles. For nuclear and antimatter missiles, it is assumed the explosion is a proximity blast occurring some distance from the target. Thus, FP is equal to the warhead yield in kilotons*10. If an attack has an armour divisor, multiply dice of damage by that divisor when calculating FP, e.g. 20d(2) is treated as 40d. For automatic fire lasers multiple FP by RoF. Otherwise, multiply FP by the square root of RoF (first converting fractional RoF’s to decimals, e.g. ¼ is 0.25). It is up to the GM whether to bother with results that give fractional FPs, or to simply round to the nearest whole number. Special Radiation Effects of Missiles: Nuclear and antimatter missiles produce radiation and EMP effects which an injure both ship crew and computers. Missiles intercepted by antimissile fire do not produce radiation. The rad dose delivered by each unintercepted missile is equal to (FP*TL*10). Add all the missiles together to make one radiation dose. See p145 for protection against radiation, and for radiation effects. If the ship has armour or a force field of DF1, it has a radiation Protection Factor of 10. DF 2 gives PF of 100, DF 3 gives a PF of 1,000, and so on.
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Post by Kage2020 on Oct 27, 2004 15:25:54 GMT -5
If a ship crew takes enough rads to incapacitate them immediately (4,000 rads or more) that ship is out of the battle. A crew that takes over 160 rads may fight out that battle but will be incapacitated within a day. Combat Rounds Battle is conducted in combat rounds. The length of time represented by each round is up to the GM. The “default” value is one hour; space battles can be drawn-out affairs. But in a close-orbital engagements, a round might be ten minutes – and in a long-range running battle between STL craft at the edge of a system, a round might be a day! The GM also decides how many combat rounds make up a “battle”. In general, a battle has ended when the forces have an opportunity to regroup and plan their next move. When a battle ends, characters make Survival rolls. Some engagements may consist of several combat rounds, one right after the other. Others may consist of several battles, with the characters having an opportunity to try more damage control, and make new battle plans, before each. Detection and EngagementBefore any combat between spacecraft can occur, the opposing forces must detect each other. To do this, the sensor operator on each ship rolls against his Electronics Operation (Sensors) skill. If one or both forces detects the other, they then decide whether they will engage in combat. If neither detects the other, no combat will occur, unless they are closing unwittingly. In this case, each makes another roll hourly, or more often if quality of sensors allows it. Two forces may pass in space and never detect each other. If detection occurs, the next step is to determine whether combat can happen. Speed is the most important factor in this; a fast ship can easily close with a slower one. But a slow ship with missiles may still get some shots at a fleeing opponent. Thus, the decision to fight usually lies with the commander of the faster force. If only one side wishes to fight, but is not appreciably faster than the foe, the question of engagement is resolved by a Quick Context of Piloting ski between the worst pilot in the fleeing fotce and each pilot in the pursuing force. Any pursuer who wins the context may engage the fleeing force. Should only one side detect the other, and the detecting side prefers not to fight, it can simply alter course to avoid closing before the other force detects it. If the detecting side wishes to engage, it can close the gap. As it closes, the opposing force will get additional sensor rolls to detect its approach; once each side has detected the other, the final decision to engage once again falls to the commander of the fastest force. Shadowing: If one force detects another without itself being detected, the detecting force may attempt to shadow the other, following its movements and staying on the very edge of sensor range. To do so, the shadowing sensor operator must make an Electronics Operation (Sensors) roll every fifteen minutes, including all appropriate modifiers, to keep a fix on the shadowed craft. Failing this roll means that the sensor contact with the shadowed craft has been lost. If the roll is successful, the shadowing pilot must then roll a Quick Context of skills against the shadowed sensor operator, Pilot vs. Electronics Operation (Sensors) to avoid being detected. If the shadowing craft has a superior sensor range or superior stealth, it can move in closer, and the sensor operator needs to roll only once per hour. The BattleIf there is a battle, whether one-on-one or fleet against fleet, the following system revolves the action. Phase 1: Contest of TacticsThe two ship captains (or force commanders) roll a Quick Contest of Tactics. If there are more than 10 vessels in the battle, use Strategy skill instead. Special circumstances and the PCs’ actions can modify the rolls, as detailed below. If one commander wins the contest by more than 3 points, he may choose either to do more damage to the foe (by shifting all his attacking results by one column to the left on the Combat Results Table) or to suffer less damage to his own forces (by shifting all his defending results by one column to the right). A commander who scores a critical success gets two column shifts; one in each direction, or both in the same direction! The commander must make his choice now; he must tell the GM, but not the opponent. Special Circumstances: The GM assigns bonuses in the Quick Contest of Tactics, or subtracts penalties, for any circumstances which affect the battle. A few examples: - Attack totally by surprise: +5 first round, +2 second round.
- Partial surprise – less than 3 minutes warning: +2 (first round only).
- Familiar space: +1 to +3 (e.g. fighting in a known asteroid field is worth +2).
- Defending your home system: +2, plus “familiar space” if applicable.
Battle Plans: If PCs are force commanders, or important in the planning of the battle, the GM should require the players to give him a battle plan (or plans, if there are PCs on both sides) before making the Tactics roll. If the GM feels these plans are especially good or bad, he may apply from +3 to -3 in the Contest of Tactics. Phase 2: Assign FirepowerEach PC who is a ship captain (including fighter pilots) now declares how aggressively he will press his own attack, as follows: - Extremely aggressive: +50% to effective Firepower of all ship weapons; -2 to ship’s effective DF.
- Aggressive: +25% to effective Firepower of all ship’s weapons; -1 to ship’s effective DF.
- Per doctrine: No modifiers.
- Defensive: -25% to effective Firepower of all ship’s weapons; +1 to ship’s effective DF.
- Extremely defensive: Halve the effective Firepower of all ship’s weapons +2 to ship’s effective DF.
The GM or Adversary decides how aggressively NPC captains will perform. The ship’s crew has no say in the captain’s decision, unless they want to stage a mutiny. Each side in the battle (players, GM and/or Adversary) now lists the amount of FP that each ship will use during the first combat round. Some weapons may be assigned to point defence (antimissile) fire; their FP cannot be used to attack enemy ships. Remaining FP should be assigned to specific enemy ships. If PCs are ship captains, each captain assigns his own weaponry. If the force commander gives specific orders about weapon assignment, it is up to the captain how closely to follow them. NPC captains are controlled by the GM or (for enemy ships) the Adversary, and may or may not follow orders exactly. Phase 3: Point Defence GunneryAny weapon may be assigned to point defence (anti-missile) fire, targeting one attacking missile. The character controlling the point defence weapon attempts his Gunner roll, plus or minus 3 times the difference in the TLs of his weapon and the enemy missile. On a successful roll, the missile is destroyed, and does not contribute its firepower to that combat. On a failure, the missile is unaffected, and that point-defence weapon may not fire at it a second time. Point-defence weapons do not contribute their firepower to the combat, regardless of whether they destroy their target missiles – or even if no missiles are fired at the ship. Point-defence gunnery is not affected by the aggressiveness of the captain’s attack. If more than one missile is fired at the ship during a given combat round, a point defence weapon may attack a second one at -2, a third one at -4, and so on. No attack may be made at a modified skill of less than 3! These modifiers are not affected by the length of the round; in a quick, close battle, the missiles will be fired at short range and can be engaged (hit or miss) quickly, while in a long-range battle it will take longer to deal with each missile. The time to hit a missile is as soon as it comes in range – they accelerate constantly and will be moving very fast if they have come in from a long distance. Any number of gunners may attack the same incoming missile, but it counts as one shot for each of them. If missiles are used for point defence, each attack on an enemy missile expends one of the ship’s own missiles. Each subsequent missile fired by the same gunner is fired at a cumulative -2 penalty, as above. Ship commanders can use NPC gunners for point defence. Unless the NPC gunner’s sill is already known, roll 1d+10 to generate a skill for an experienced gunner, or 1d+6 for a non-gunner pressed into service. Gunnery computers can also be used, at their effective skill (usually 12 or more). Characters who serve on point defence cannot attempt damage control, etc., on that same round. PCs with ESP ability can use their Precognition skill. Add (Precognition-10) to Gunner skill, spending one fatigue point, to guess where the incoming missile is…
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Post by Kage2020 on Oct 27, 2004 15:27:48 GMT -5
Phase 4: Computing AttacksEach PC who is serving as a gunner (including fighter pilots, but not including point defence gunners) may now make a Gunner roll. Fighter pilots who are both flying and shooting my substitute a Piloting roll if they choose. For PCs only, each point by which the roll is made increases the weapon’s effective Firepower by 10%. A critical success doubles Firepower. (Missing the roll reduces that weapon’s Firepower by 10% for each point by which the roll was missed, and a critical failure reduces Firepower to zero for that round.) For one-man fighters, Firepower of the whole ship is affected. Each ship in the battle now undergoes a single attack, based on the total effective Firepower of all weapons aimed at it (except for destroyed missiles). The attacking Firepower is compared with the ship’s Defence Factor to yield a ratio, rounding in the defender’s favour. The Combat Results Table then gives the outcome of the attack. A ship’s basic Defence Factor is given by its armour, force fields and stealth, if any. If a hull is unarmoured, its Defence Factor (DF) starts at 0. If a ship’s final DF, after modifications for stealth and hull size, is 0 or less, treat it as having a DF of 0.25. An aggressive attack lowers effective defence, and vice versa. However, a ship can get bonuses or penalties to Defence Factor for other things. - 10 or few cy: +2
- 100 or fewer cy: +1
- 1,000 or fewer cy: 0.
- 10,000 or fewer cy: -1
- 100,000 or fewer cy: -2
- 1,000,000 or fewer cy: -3
- Over a million cy: -4
- Ship has a warp drive: +2
- Ship can make short, aimed hyperspace skips at intervals of 5 minutes or less: +1
Combat ResultsTo determine damage, the attacker rolls one die on the table below, on the line appropriate to the final odds ratio. Treat any result of less than 5 to 1 as having no effect. Divide any result of greater than 1,000 to 1 into separate attacks – one or more at 1,000 to 1, plus a remainder. Combat Results Table Odds | 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7+ | 5:1 | 1/0/0 | - | - | - | - | - | - | 10:1 | 1/1/0 | 1/0/0 | - | - | - | - | - | 20:1 | 2/1/0 | 1/1/0 | 1/0/0 | - | - | - | - | 50:1 | 2/2/0 | 2/1/0 | 1/1/0 | 1/0/0 | 1/0/0 | - | - | 100:1 | 3/2/0 | 2/2/0 | 2/1/0 | 1/1/0 | 1/0/0 | 1/0/0 | - | 200:1 | 3/2/1 | 2/2/1 | 2/2/0 | 2/1/0 | 1/1/0 | 1/1/0 | 1/0/0 | 500:1 | 3/2/2 | 3/2/1 | 2/2/1 | 2/2/1 | 2/1/1 | 1/1/1 | 1/1/0 | 1,000:1 | 3/3/3 | 3/3/2 | 3/2/2 | 2/2/2 | 2/2/1 | 2/1/1 | 1/1/1 |
Phase 5: Computing Ship DamageThe combat result roll indicates which ship damage tables (below) are checked, and how many times. A result of 3/2/1 would indicate three Light Damage rolls, two Medium Damage rolls, and one Heavy Damage roll. When rolling on the ship damage tables, roll 1 die for ships of hull size under 1,000 cy, 2 dice for ships of 1,000 to 10,000 cy, and 3 dice for ships over 10,000 cy. Lighter damage rolls are made before heavier ones. Weapon and computer damage, and “shaken up” results, are cumulative but must be repaired separately. Ignore – and do not reroll – results which damage a component that has already been destroyed. Light Ship Damage Roll | Description | 1 | Ship shaken up – all subsequent rolls involving ship operations at -1. Requires 3 damage-control rolls to fix. | 2 | Drive damaged – ship at -10% drive power (assume a 10% less of acceleration). | 3 | One main weapon damaged – an Armoury+3 roll (or equivalent) repairs it. (If precise armaments are unknown, GM decides on lost FP.) | 4 | Life support damaged – loses 10% of original capacity (i.e. ship’s operating range is cut by 10%).* | 5 | Sensor suite damaged – all sensor rolls at -3. Halve Firepower of non-missile weapons. | 6 | Power plant or capacitor bank damaged, lose 1/4 its base capacity or 10MW, whichever is greater. This result may be rolled more than once. | 7 | One weapon in six (but at least one) is damaged – each at -1 to hit on point defence. (If precise armaments are unknown, the GM decides which weapons are affected.)* | 8 | One accessory damaged – roll randomly, or GM assigns. | 9 | One main auxiliary craft damaged – apply one meaningful Medium damage result.* | 10 | One area (not otherwise mentioned on this table) damaged. | 11 | Fuel storage holed. Lose 10% of remaining fuel or reaction mass. | 12 | Landing gear destroyed; ship must be repaired in space or make a belly landing (Hull Integrity roll at -4 penalty). | 13 | Cargo area (lacking that, hangar deck or passenger area) shaken up. Contents may be damaged.* | 14 | Passenger area (lacking that, cargo area or hangar deck) shaken up. Passengers take 1d damage each.* | 15-16 | Hangar deck (lacking that, passenger area or cargo area) shaken up. Each auxiliary craft takes one Light Damage roll.* | 17-18 | Drive damaged – as #2 above. |
Medium Ship Damage Table Roll | Descripton | 1 | Ship shaken up – all subsequent rolls involving ship operations at -2. A damage-control roll at -4 reduces penalty to -1. A second roll at -6 removes the penalty. | 2 | Drive damaged – ship at -50% drive power (assume a 50% loss in acceleration). | 3 | One main weapon damaged – halve its firepower. Requires 2 damage-control rolls to repair. (If precise armaments are unknown, GM decides on lost FP.)* | 4 | Life support damaged – loses 30% of original capacity (i.e. ship’s operating range is cut by 30%).* | 5 | Ship’s computer damaged – all rolls using computer assist are at -3, unless a backup is available. | 6 | Power plant or capacitor bank damaged, losing half its base capacity or 20 MW, whichever is greater. This result may be rolled more than once.* | 7 | One weapon in six (but at least one) wholly destroyed. (If precise armaments are unknown, the GM decides which weapons are affected; this should reduce total FP by 1/6.)* | 8 | Artificial gravity (if it exists) knocked out; all crew now need Free Fall skill on any rolls they try. Reduce effective Firepower by 10%. If there is no artificial gravity, one area not mentioned on this table is damaged.* | 9 | Main bridge damaged – all rolls by this ship personnel, except Survival rolls, at -1. Damage-control at -3.* | 10 | One area (not otherwise mentioned on this table) damaged.* |
[/td] [td]Fuel storage holed. Lose 25% of remaining fuel or reaction mass.*[/td] [/tr] [tr] [td]12[/td] [td]Intership communication ability lost; will require four damage-control rolls to recover. Until then, ship cannot communicate or coordinate with other ships in the battle.[/td] [/tr] [tr] [td]13[/td] [td]Cargo area damaged (lacking that, hangar deck or passenger area). Cargo takes approximately 10% damage, as determined by GM.*[/td] [/tr] [tr] [td]14[/td] [td]Passenger area damaged (lacking that, cargo area or hangar deck). Each passenger takes 2d damage.*[/td] [/tr] [tr] [td]15-16[/td] [td]Hangar deck or boat bay damaged (lacking that, passenger area or cargo area). Each auxiliary craft takes one Light and one Medium damage roll.*[/td] [/tr] [tr] [td]17-18[/td] [td]Drive damaged – as #2 above.[/td] [/tr][/table]
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Post by Kage2020 on Oct 27, 2004 15:29:50 GMT -5
Heavy Ship Damage Table Roll | Description | 1 | Power plant or capacitor bank destroyed. Ships with antimatter engines blow up. **/** | 2 | Drive destroyed (no repair possible). **/** | 3 | One main weapon destroyed. (If precise armaments are unknown, GM decides on lost FP.) ** | 4 | Force field projector destroyed – if there are no force fields, sensor suite lost. | 5 | Ship’s computer destroyed; halve Firepower unless a backup is available. | 6 | Ship’s frame sprung. Reduce Hull Integrity by 1d. Cost to repair will be 1d*1-% of base hull cost. | 7 | Roll 1 die for each point; a 6 destroys it. At least one weapon must be destroyed. (If precise armaments are unknown, the GM decides which weapons are affected; this should reduce total FP by at least 1/6.) ** | 8 | Artificial gravity (if it exists) destroyed; all crew now need Free Fall skill on any rolls they try. Reduce Firepower by 10%. If there is no artificial gravity, one area not mentioned on this table is destroyed.* | 9 | One bridge destroyed – ship is dead in space, unless there is another bridge.** | 10 | One area (not otherwise mentioned on this table) is destroyed. ** | 11 | Fuel or reaction mass storage opened to space. All fuel or reaction mass (roll if ship has both) is lost. ** | 12 | As #4 above. | 13 | Cargo area destroyed (lacking that, hangar deck or passenger area). Contents take 50% to 100% damage, depending on their nature – GM’s ruling. ** | 14 | Passenger area opened to vacuum (lacking that, cargo area or hangar deck). ** | 15-16 | Hangar deck or boat bay destroyed (lacking that, passenger area or cargo area). All auxiliary craft take 1/1/1 damage. 1d damage-control rolls will be needed to open a passage to launch auxiliaries. ** | 17 | Drive destroyed. **/**/** | 18 | Power plant or capacitor bank destroyed. **/**/** |
Damage Table Notes: Any time the damage result could describe more than one ship system (e.g. “drive” when the ship has two different drives), roll randomly to see which one is affected. With some FTL drives, it will be impossible to enter FTL until the drive is fully operational. With other drives, the ship is simply slowed. Damage to the sensor suites halves Firepower of all weapons except missiles, until is repaired. Loss of the sensor suit means that no weapons except missiles can be used! Possible PC InjuryWhen a damage result shows a *, any PC in that area of the ship must immediately make a Survival roll. When a ** is shown, any PC in that area must make a Survival roll at -5. If two ** are shown, two survival rolls are required, and so on. Note that for a ship of 100 cy or less, anyone on board is effective “in” any area hit. If no specific plan of the ship is available, the GM decides who is affected by each hit. Hull Integrity (HI)A Hull Integrity roll must accompany each Medium or Heavy damage result the Hull Integrity roll is made first. The basic HI is equal to the ship’s TL plus its hull (armour) DF, rounded down; roll this number or less to avoid damage. If using the GURPS Space or GURSP Vehicles rules, heavy compartmentalisation adds 1 to HI; total compartmentalisation (typical of most warships) adds 2. If the damage was Heavy, roll at a -2 penalty. Treat any critical failures as ordinary failures. Any failed Hull Integrity roll will cause problems. Each individual failure can be repaired in one hour by an Engineering, Mechanic (Starship), or Vacc Suit roll, as appropriate, unless indicated otherwise: - Roll failed by 1-2: Some compartments lose pressure. Make a separate HI roll for each compartment that matters – e.g. bridge, engineering, control rooms for each weapon. A failed roll puts that compartment in vacuum. Everyone in the compartment must roleplay their attempt to escape and/or get into a vac suit! Compartments in vacuum cannot be used except by vacc-suited crew.
- Roll failed by 3-4: As above, but all rolls at -2.
- Roll failed by 5-6: As above. Also, roll separately for each major ship system (each drive, power plant, important weapons, life support, and so on), again at -2, to see if it lost power. It will cost 10% of the hull cost to permanently repair this in a shipyard.
- Roll failed by 7-8: As above, but all rolls at -4. It will cost 25% of the hull cost to permanently repair this in a shipyard.
- Roll failed by 9: Hull loses pressure entirely. All power conduits are broken. All ship systems are wrecked. No damage control possible; if the ship cannot be towed to a shipyard for salvage, it is lost. All crew make Vacc Suit rolls at -5.
- Roll failed by 10+: Hull breaks open entirely. If the ship is landed, it collapses and is wrecked. If it is in atmosphere it crashes! Otherwise, the ship entirely splits open, spilling its contents into space. No damage control is possible. All systems are shut down; every man for himself. All crew must make Vacc Suit rolls at -6.
Phase 6: Damage ControlAt the end of each combat round, after damage is assessed and PC injury checked, all PCs may attempt damage control (see below). Damage control is considered to start as soon as the round starts, even though it is computed after damage. PCs who are at half their HT or less may attempt damage control at -2 to their rolls, but those at HT 3 or less may not attempt damage control at all. If rounds are an hour long the first two PCs treated by each medic may attempt damage control based on their HT after treatment. Only PCs who are not involved in controlling the ship or firing the guns may attempt damage control. This requires skills appropriate to the damage. Engineering, Shipbuilding (Starship), Mechanic, and Armour (ship’s weapons) are always appropriate; the GM may rule that others are appropriate for specific sorts of damage. Vacc Suit is appropriate for hull or other exterior damage. Each PC may make one damage-control roll per hour. The GM may allow PC commanders to use the services of NPC damage control crews as well. In general, not more than 10% of the crew should be considered capable of attempting these rolls, at skills of 1d+10. A successful roll against a given piece of damage repairs it temporarily (a shipyard will still be needed, and real repairs will cost an average of 50% of original cost). Failure has no effect. A critical failure breaks the equipment, and may have worse effects. For instance, a critical failure to repair a fission plant will irradiate the whole engine room, and a critical failure on an antimatter plant will blow the ship up! Damage control on computers and sensors requires an Electronics roll with the appropriate specialty. This is a matter of quick troubleshooting and replacing modules. If the first roll fails, the damage cannot be repaired until after the battle. Some types of damage will give penalties to the roll, or require more than one roll, as noted on the Damage Tables. Note that when a component is listed as destroyed rather than damaged, it cannot be repaired unless the ship has a spare available! If a component is repaired, and then damaged again in the same battle, subsequent damage-control rolls are at -2 for each time the component has been damaged. This does not apply to welding the hull or splicing power lines after a Hull Integrity failure. Emergency Medical Aid: The ship’s medic, and anybody else with First Aid skill, will be busy during battle. Anyone who is injured during a round of battle may be the subject of a First Aid roll during the damage-control phase. First aid takes 10 minutes per victim. A medic can get a skill bonus for heroism by taking a penalty on his next Survival roll (or vice versa), as described below. The medical team’s ability to get key crew back into action can make the difference between victory and defeat, especially on a small ship. Ending the RoundIn an abstract system, ending an engagement must be at the discretion of the GM. As a rule, any ship faster (i.e. with better acceleration) than its foes can break away. In some situations, slower ships may still escape by scattering, hiding, landing on a planet, and so on. GMs should be sympathetic to clever PC plots to escape a hopeless battle! If the engagement is at slower-than-light speeds, fight one last round of combat using missile weapons only. Starting a New RoundIf both sides still want to fight, or if one side cannot (yet) escape, another round of combat begins. Recalculate the firepower of both sides to account for lost or damaged ships, dead or unconscious crew, and any reinforcements that may have appeared. Battle plans do not affect the Tactics rolls made for the second and subsequent rounds of a battle. Starting a New BattleThe GM may also rule that the forces will have time to regroup, repair and make new plans, even though both want to continue fighting. This might be the case if, for instance, the forces met at high speed and passed through each other while firing! In the case, determine survival as described below. Allow one damage-control roll per PC for each hour that passes until the next battle. If FTL radio exists, forces can communicate with their bases.
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Post by Kage2020 on Oct 27, 2004 15:32:05 GMT -5
Player Character SurvivalAt the conclusion of the entire battle, each PC and important NPC must make a Survival roll, based on his HT. This is modified by the size (in cubic yards) of the PC’s ship, and the degree of the heaviest damage if suffered. PCs with Combat Reflexes get an extra +2 to effective HT for this roll, because they can react quickly to emergencies. Those who have had the bad luck to be in a portion of the ship that takes damage must also make one or more Survival rolls (using al the modifiers listed below) during the battle. It is assumed that a vac suit is available; those without access to a vac suit have -2 on any Survival roll. Actual airtight body armour gives a +1 or better – GM’s option. Degree of Damage | Survival Roll Mod. | Ship Size | Survival Roll Mod. | Light | 0 | 100,000+ | +2 | Medium | -1 | 50,000+ | +1 | Heavy | -2 | 10,000+ | - | More than one Heavy | -3 | 5,000+ | - | - | - | 1,000+ | -1 | - | - | Under 1,000 | -2 | - | - | Any non-military ship | -2 |
Having determined the appropriate Survival roll for each PC, roll to determine the injuries in incurred during action: Survival Roll Result | Injury | Made by 5+ or Critical Success | Unjurt | Made by 1 to 4 | 1 hit | Made exactly | 2 hits | Missed by 1 or 2 | 1d+1 hits | Missed by 3 or 4 | Two 1d wounds | Missed by 5 or 6 | Two 2d wounds | Missed by 7+ or Critical Failure | Three 2d wounds |
Crew LossesIn a situation where there are a great many NPCs on the PCs’ ship, a “group survival roll” may be made to see how many “generic crew” have been killed or incapacitated. Assign the crew a generic HT of 10, unless they are of a race with a different average HT. Roll, using all the above modifiers. The ship loses 10% of its current crew for each point by which the roll was failed. Check once at the end of each battle, and again during the battle for all crew in a compartment affected by a damage result marked with a *. Heroism and CautionAt any time during the combat, a PC who makes a skill roll (for any reason) may elect to behave either heroically or cautiously. Heroic behaviour gives a +1 or +2 bonus on the skill roll; cautious behaviour gives a -1 or -2. And either choice gives the opposite modifier on the PC’s next Survival roll. For instance, suppose a PC is attempting damage control. He may get up to a +2 bonus on the roll by declaring that he is behaving heroically; perhaps he is entering a potentially radioactive area in order to make a repair quickly. Likewise, he may declare that he is behaving cautiously, taking up to a -2 penalty. Either way, the opposite modifier applies on that PC’s next Survival roll, whenever it is. These modifiers are cumulative. An engineer who is heroic three times before a Survival roll, for a +2 each time, will take a -6 when that roll is made. But each bonus or penalty applies only to one roll… the next one made. The GM may also declare that certain damage-control tasks are hazardous and require the crewman to take a penalty on his next Survival roll if he tries those tasks at all! The effect of bravery or caution can extend beyond the battlefield. If your daring helps carry the day (and you are lucky enough to be noticed by the Right People), you might receive a decoration, a promotion, or even a patron. Cowardice in the face of the enemy will have obvious negative effects.
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Post by RascalLeader on Oct 30, 2004 12:20:21 GMT -5
quote] Please note that I’m not trying to suggest that this system is used, only that it provides an ideal means of integrating BFG and the more detailed RPG as well as refining the latter so that it is more consistent with the wargame (as far as possible given the relative differences in detail involved). [/quote] So, I assume your looking for someone to tell you a bit about BFG? Although the game is quite simple as wargames go it is might take my inter day up to write the rules so you can make some sort of comparision. If you ask nicely I might be able to able to summerise it, or e-mail you a copy of the basic rules. However from the information I have just read through it did have some simlerarites between the RPG element and BFG. Each weapon was a firepower/strenght value and some of the ship damage table you had were almost spitting images of the critical damage tables in the book. I would tell you more but its getting dark now an I need to take the dog for a walk . Perhaps it would be best to ask in what areas speifically you need to know about rather then me writing out 30ish pages of rules.
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Post by Kage2020 on Oct 30, 2004 18:35:24 GMT -5
Essentially what I'm after is 'conversions' of BFG ships into the terms presented above. It would be best, I'm guessing, that people worked together to produce them. I'm sure that my reading of the BFG rules would be different to someone else hence the request for discussion... It offer a perfect opportunity by which wargamers and roleplayers can come together, even though it needs a tad more help from the wargamers to get moving...
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Post by RascalLeader on Oct 31, 2004 22:16:54 GMT -5
Then I will try my best to help If you want the BFG satitistics go here: www.specialist-games.com/battlefleetgothic/fleets.htm# and click on "click here to Learn more" for the each of the fleets. Cubic Years?? In BFG ships are clumped into 4 main catogaries, Battleships, cruiser, escorts and attack crafts. In BFG these would be reprisended by bother the armour value, shields and the number next to the ship type (Cruiser/8). This last value would be perhaps of interest to you since it reprisents then mass of a ship. A bigger ship even if it has the same armour of a smaller one has the advantage since it has more bulk to take the hits. Where as 'escort' types only have one point of this making them easy to destroy, cruisers and battle ships have a much higher value. Battleships and Cruisers are the big guns. Escorts are a broader catergory that have class title such as destoryers, or frigates. It does not make much difference to how the operate. Escorts have the same sort of powerful weapons cruiser have, but since they are much smaller ships they cannot take the damage the big boys can. Attack crafts are comprised of fighters, bomber and boarding crafts but not really considered ships in their own right since they are too small to be effective against battleships. It is only a matter of adapting the current stats for this to work in an RPG. You might be able to lift the BFG weapon system right out of the game. In the game the different weapons avilible do not reprisent individual cannons but a collection of guns strunge together to cover a perticuler arc of the ships. The damage charts in BFG are very similer to the ones you have posted. the ones yoy would need no real work done on them anyway since its already orented towards the Roleplaying side of things, which is what you want. This bit I am not sure about. I had sort of assumped it would would be one or two player crewed ships against NPC. Do you mean that if that ten players each have a ship, or that they have a load of NPC ships on their side? If so are you expecting them to have large fleet engagements? Perhaps a roll for the crew type as well would be in order. For instance on a Imperial ship having all the techpreists onboard being killed off would make it impossible for the ship to be repaired. This compared to one of thousands of servants on board being killed is quite important to find out.
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Post by Kage2020 on Dec 5, 2004 21:56:03 GMT -5
If you want the BFG satitistics go here... I've gone to the site and looked over the statistics, although it obviously needs someone familiar with the game system to help in translation of that to soething that is practicable. And, incidentally, GW really do "pretty" well, don't they. <sigh> (But incidentally, how do they get away with calling a ship the Black Star! ) and click on "click here to Learn more" for the each of the fleets. The question comes on how to represent this information in the slightly more detailed GURPS system? Care to take a crack...? Erm, cubic yards. I won't say obviously, but it kinda makes more sense than years! In BFG ships are clumped into 4 main catogaries, Battleships, cruiser, escorts and attack crafts. We also have to consider the expanded ship designations that CELS and others contributed to the project. I'm rather fond of them. In BFG these would be reprisended by bother the armour value, shields and the number next to the ship type (Cruiser/8). I'm familiar with this type of system from the Babylon 5 RPG, which I borrowed for an alterantive system somewhere along the lines when I was using Cyberpunk 2.0.2.0. to come up with a sci-fi universe. The question is how to translate this information into the system that I posted above... This last value would be perhaps of interest to you since it reprisents then mass of a ship. Seems that 'DR' based on 'category' is basically this statistic... the bigger it is the more it can soak up damage. Even if you have a high-tech ship that is smaller, it can soak less damage than one that is significantly larger. Battleships and Cruisers are the big guns. One would gather. A dreadnought is commonly just the most advanded Battleship of the time. It does not make much difference to how the operate. Escorts have the same sort of powerful weapons cruiser have, but since they are much smaller ships they cannot take the damage the big boys can. So, good attack rating but lower DF because of size... Attack crafts are comprised of fighters, bomber and boarding crafts but not really considered ships in their own right since they are too small to be effective against battleships. OMG... haven't you seen Star Wars!? <Kage shakes head in tongue-in-cheek fashion> With that as an aside, this is the difference in the systems... In the RPG as in the real world they can have a difference in some regards, but when you're talking the grand, gross scheme of things (i.e. BFG) nothing that would be, as you significant. It is only a matter of adapting the current stats for this to work in an RPG. Which is why the above system is posted, at least to help me do things in GURPS. It would significantly help in the creation of weapon and defensive systems, for example. You might be able to lift the BFG weapon system right out of the game. Only with conversion. An FP1 for a Hemlock-class Destroyer is not particularly devastating! But just how might that translate...? In the game the different weapons avilible do not reprisent individual cannons but a collection of guns strunge together to cover a perticuler arc of the ships. To be fair, they sometimes do in the case of major spinal weapon mounts. Is not the Nova Canon an example of this, even if a poor one (i.e. because of the concept of the nova canon itself!)... The damage charts in BFG are very similer to the ones you have posted. And those are...? The point here is that we need an RPG fan and a wargame BFG fan working together and then, hopefully, the conributions of other people. This bit I am not sure about. I had sort of assumped it would would be one or two player crewed ships against NPC. This is where RPG and wargame differ. In the RPG the characters are the important thing. In the wargame it only matters which ships are blown up or not! This is probably not something that needs to be worried about. I just though that it would be a good thing to post the complete system... Perhaps a roll for the crew type as well would be in order. For instance on a Imperial ship having all the techpreists onboard being killed off would make it impossible for the ship to be repaired. I would strongly argue against the fact that it would make it impossible to be repaired, but you do have a valid point. With that said, however, the point is not to develop this RPG 'battle system' into something more 40k, but to use it as a bridge between the wargame and the more detailed RPG for means of the construction of starships. Ultimately it would be good for 40k, Inquistor, etc. Edit: As a way forward it seems fairly obvious that we are going to have to create some 'test statistics' and use them to fight within the system above. It would then be interesting to see whether this is consistent with a similar 'battle' in BFG. If it is not, then back to the drawing board. If it is then we can expand it to other ship types and/or racial craft types depending on your own suggestions.
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Post by schoon on Dec 6, 2004 21:38:42 GMT -5
Just as an aside, I'd strongly suggest that you pick up a copy of the BFG rulebook, which can usually be found on eBay relatively inexpensively. I suspect this would give you far better insights than we can. However, I do play if you have questions...
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Post by Kage2020 on Dec 6, 2004 22:32:26 GMT -5
Unfortunately, I don't like to play the wargame and therefore any money spent on products that are dedicated to it would be fairly superfluous for me. I was actually hoping that I could find an even cheaper copy of them. *cough*
That and I would actually have to play the game to understand the rules and, well, from what I remember of Space Fleet it would just annoy me. I'd end up wanting to make the rules more detailed, then to ignore the rules and the miniatures and use RPG rules.
So thought that I would skip the whole being annoyed phase and merely ask other people for their experience... get people to work together, that sort of thing.
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Post by RascalLeader on Dec 8, 2004 21:20:50 GMT -5
First of all I know I was being rather obvous in my posts, but its best to get it out of the way. Certainly I am going to start on the adaption of a Emperor Class Battleship. Current BFG states for it are on the website I gave; I Going to change them to something of more use when I have the time (Give it a week ) hopefully when I post it their will be something to go off. I might also do a fighter as well just to give some sence of scale. However One of the big problems is going to be deciding the size. The last time I look on that thread it was still going around in circles. So I'll put down a > < range in. Tell me what you want out of it *Cough* I'll post the damage tables next time. What I meant was that firepower 1 could be converted to say to 100 firepower rating in the RPG, given 10FP to ten cannon or something along those lines. The fact that they already have ratings for things does give us guildlines to work with.Example: A sword is always more powerfull then an Iconoclast. The only time that a fighter took down a battleship in Star Wars was by crashing into the bridge of the Star destroyer! (not counting EP1!) Really? Your saying yards makes more sence? (Brake out Imperial conversion equations)
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Post by Kage2020 on Dec 9, 2004 16:26:49 GMT -5
Excellent! I am going to start on the adaption of a Emperor Class Battleship. That's the one that was going to make an apperance as the Anargo flagship, was it not? I might also do a fighter as well just to give some sence of scale. And, just for kicks and giggles, how about an eldar ship while you're at it? However One of the big problems is going to be deciding the size. Perhaps revisit the thread and try to draw peoples' attention back to it? Tell me what you want out of it *Cough* Erm... The only time that a fighter took down a battleship in Star Wars was by crashing into the bridge of the Star destroyer! (not counting EP1!) Was actually thinking of the stonking Death Star myself. Really? Your saying yards makes more sence? (Brake out Imperial conversion equations) Grin. Absolutely not. Just that it made more sense as a unit of measurement in the context... [/quote]
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Post by RascalLeader on Dec 9, 2004 18:28:49 GMT -5
Okay here they are. These examples are only to try and get the ball rolling, brainstorming if you will. Tear them apart if needs be [shadow=red,left,300]Emperor Class Battleship[/shadow] Size: 30,000,000Cubic Meters (Length 1500m x width 100m x height 200) Defence Factor (Total= 38)Hull: 22 Armour: 10 Shields: 6 Firepower (Total= 1900)Weapon 1 - Point defence Lasers (Total= 100) Type: Defensive Lasers Number: 50 Arc: All Weapon 2 - Port Weapon Batteries (Total FP= 500) Type: Laser Cannons Number: 10 Arc: Left Weapon 3 - StarPort Weapon Batteries (Total FP= 500) Type: Laser Cannons Number: 10 Arc: Right Weapon 4 -Dorsal Weapon Batteries (Total FP= 400) Type: Laser Cannons Number: 8 Arc: Front/Left/Right Weapon 5 - Dorsal Weapon Batteries (Total FP= 400) Type: Laser Cannons Number: 8 (x50) Arc: Front/Left/Right Launch Bays * Port launch Bay * Starport Launch Bay [shadow=red,left,300]Fury Interceptor [/shadow] Size: 384 Cubic Meters (Length 12m x width 8m x height 4) Defence Factor (Total – 5)Hull: 4 Armour: 1 Shields: 0 Firepower (Total= 100)Weapon 1 - (Total= 100) Number: 2 (x50) Type: Lasers cannons Arc: Forward [shadow=red,left,300]Notes[/shadow] Size - Okay I know The Emperor Class is a lot bigger then the guide you gave but I believe I am being conservative in my estimate. The Imperium does not design ships that are perfectly balanced for size and firepower; for them bigger is better. Speed - Since we did not go over it, I have not included a value for speed. Weapons- I had somewhat of a difficulty with these, while have balanced it in a way that is in line with the BFG states. When multiplying the Defence Factor (I did it by 60%) you often end up with very odd values. With this, the biggest problem is coming up with a value for the point defences, which don’t match what I am going off; they are more just mopping up left over FP. For the fighter I multiplied the defence factor by 20% being a much smaller ship, which end up giving them about the same firepower for each of the Laser cannons of the Emperor class. This seemed odd at first but it started to fix itself in my mind that the firepower for a Laser cannon would be 50FP no matter what ship it is on. Ah.. I am not sure. I picked it because its the biggest heaviest Imperial ship avalible, which would be the opposite of the Fighter. Creates a high and low value for us to work from. Why not? I'll start on one. I'll get to use stealth Values for once Its a big book 160+ pages. Thats a lot of scanning. Here is the contents so you can narrow down what you want. 1. Rules 2.The Battlefield 3. Hobbie section (Ship Colours and bases) 4. Scenarios 5. The Galaxy of the 41st Millennium (An section dedicated to fluff on the Imperial Navy, and the Gothic Sector History) 6. Ships, Stations and Orbital Defences 7. Campaign rules (including some nice images of how GW thinks a sector should look like) However if you *Cough* want all of it, It will take me a few weeks. Ah but that was not a battle ship, now was it? ;D:P Well as you might have noticted I've done it in meters sorry but the old grey cells can't cope with translating it into yards. I think its something like adding 15% on top of meters
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Post by Minister on Jan 7, 2005 21:24:30 GMT -5
For reference, the Emperor class is not the Battlefleet Anargo Flagship, but is one of the battleships within Anargo.
It's a bit late to look with any chance of comprehension, I may do a better job of checking at some other time.
I would advise, Kage, that you make attempts at getting the Gothic files from the Specialist Games site. Downloads take ages, but the pictures are vewwy pwettey.
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