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Post by Kage2020 on Jan 1, 2004 12:02:53 GMT -5
There has been some discussion on how orks achieve warp travel. As this is related ultimately to concepts behind the 'wily ork empire' (the term 'empire' implying a form of structure which may be precluded by the nature of ork warp travel) I thought that I would open this up for discussion. In the absence of other opinions at the moment I will offer up the original logic behind ork interstellar travel: Orks make the use of spacehulks and/or captured ships to travel between the stars. If the former then travel is based upon the vagaries of currents, etc. If the latter, then they are have more volition in the matter. Kage
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Post by CELS on Jan 1, 2004 15:59:54 GMT -5
Do you by this suggest that all ork ships such as Kroozers would be incapable of warp travel? Though I can't really prove such a claim wrong, it would make very little sense, since the majority of the orkish vessels in the Gothic war were not space hulks nor captured ships, leaving them with a very immobile fleet...
And why would captured ships be better than their own ships in travelling between stars? Surely, the only fundamental difference between an Imperial ship travelling in the warp and an Ork ship, is that the Ork ship might not have a navigator.
*lightbulb* I'll ask this question on the Portent forum.
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Post by Kage2020 on Jan 1, 2004 16:35:47 GMT -5
That was, IIRC and as stated, the original 'fluff'. Nothing more and I suggest nothing in the long run. Remember that the wargame is something that I have only a passing, but increasing, interest in. *lightbulb* I'll ask this question on the Portent forum. LMAO... Given the nature of Portent at the moment. Well, let's just say that I have no real hopes in this direction. Would any other members like to contribute thus far? Kage
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Post by Sikkukkut on Jan 1, 2004 20:27:37 GMT -5
I don't think that orks are completely incapable of building warp drives, but it doesn't seem to be something they're very good at - they seem to prefer snagging hulks and using captured ships (suitably orkified as per the 'Ammer class) or salvaged engines. The very strong impression that the ork literature gives is that orks by and large hitch onto whatever's passing and go where the currents take them; the last edition's writeup for Nazdreg ug Urdgrub's hulk Scylla mentioned that his boyz seemed to have gained a degree of control over the hulk's movements, in a way that implied that this was highly unusual and possibly unique.
In more recent references, the third Armageddon war seems to have shown a much more directed migration by orks. Part of this I put down to the Waaagh!, since it seems logical to me that the psychic momentum of such an event can affect the warp enough to firstly draw a large concentration of orks together and then to set them drifting in a single direction. I doubt that this is the result of conscious direction. Secondly, there may have been modifications to the ork ships by Orkimedes that provided them with abilities similar to Scylla's.
So for me it's a two-tiered model. Firstly, under normal circumstances, orks who get restless will hop onto something pre-existing that a Mekboy thinks he can get into the warp and then sit and wait until they emerge near something they can go and hit. When a Waaagh! is brewing or has started orks become energised and will be more liable to go out of their way to loot or salvage warp engines, or at a pinch construct their own rather dodgy ones.
Something that occurs to me: the ork list in the original BFG rulebook, which was for actual ork-constructed ships, was meant for ork reavers and bandits who might well have only barely had interstellar capabilities anyway. The actual Waaagh! list from Warp Storm, which was supposed to represent a proper full-on war migration, centred around hulks and roks. I imagine there could be a decent argument built that orks mainly use hulks for migrations (with roks hitch-hiking in the hulk's warp field) and build kroozas and the smaller ships when they've arrived somewhere.
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Post by CELS on Jan 2, 2004 12:56:30 GMT -5
LMAO... Given the nature of Portent at the moment. Well, let's just say that I have no real hopes in this direction. It seems you were right to not get your hopes up. What's happening to Portent at the moment then? (Parden the OffT venturing. A short answer will do ) Sikkukkut, I actually believe that the orks do have a knack for building warp drives. After all, they do know how to build teleportas and forcefields and such warp based weapons as the shokk attack gun. Unfortunately, I can't really back this up with official fluff. You have to admit though; if it is not uncommon for a mekboy to build a weapon that creates a tunnel through warp spaces to hurl snotlings through the warp, an ability to build warp drives wouldn't be far off.
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Post by Farseer Kythil on Jan 2, 2004 13:10:08 GMT -5
I actually believe that the orks do have a knack for building warp drives. After all, they do know how to build teleportas and forcefields and such warp based weapons as the shokk attack gun. But do the Orks actually realise how they accomplished it? From what I've read the Orks have no real understanding of how they have built the complex devices (such as the Teleporta) as it was supposed to have originated from encoded schematics.
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Post by CELS on Jan 2, 2004 13:59:36 GMT -5
Well, they don't need to understand the warp drives for them to work either. If the mekboyz' aptitude for technology is in fact imprinted in their DNA or whatever, then I would think that the brainboyz would include a recipe for warp drives.
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Post by Kage2020 on Jan 2, 2004 14:17:48 GMT -5
The 'genetic knowledge' of orks is one of those things that I've always been fairly uncomfortable with... and the whole 'gadgeteering' approach. Ah well... guess that is why I have limited my own input on this race. Kage
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Post by Farseer Kythil on Jan 3, 2004 5:28:00 GMT -5
The 'genetic knowledge' of orks is one of those things that I've always been fairly uncomfortable with... and the whole 'gadgeteering' approach. Ah well... guess that is why I have limited my own input on this race. The human race has also suffered from this 'gadgeteering' approach. The Adeptus Mechanicus are aware of it: In the Life is Knowledge ceremony, a sample is taken of the Initiate’s tissue and this sample is analysed by a Magos Genetor. At some time in the distant past, probably during the Dark Age of Technology, there was thought to be some danger of losing mankind’s technology base. Using means that are lost to the mists of time, large amounts of information and knowledge were coded into the very essence of mankind. This information resides there within all of us and, to the Adeptus Mechanicus, contributes in no small part to our own value.Edit: I realise I have gone way OffT but I was only trying to demonstrate that the 'gadgeteering' approach wasn't confined to the Orks.
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Post by zholud on Jan 3, 2004 6:37:04 GMT -5
You have to admit though; if it is not uncommon for a mekboy to build a weapon that creates a tunnel through warp spaces to hurl snotlings through the warp, an ability to build warp drives wouldn't be far off. To say the truth, right now I theorise that telyporta, Shokk Gun, short jumps made by 13th Wolves company, other psyker/Astropath short warp jumps are in reality shift into warp, move there on pre-achieved in real space energy and re-appear/phase back to real space. Thus such jumps are very short, often limited with the battlefield. Navigators instead use warp currents, and travel on large distances.
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Post by Kage2020 on Jan 3, 2004 14:12:03 GMT -5
Okay, so the orks might be able to produce 'primitive' warp drives. Fairy snuff... but they're still going to need a manufacturing industry to be able to do this! ...The human race has also suffered from this 'gadgeteering' approach. The Adeptus Mechanicus are aware of it:...I realise I have gone way OffT but I was only trying to demonstrate that the 'gadgeteering' approach wasn't confined to the Orks. What you describe is not the genetic/racial knowledge of the orks but, seeminly, rather information encoded in the 'junk' portion of the genome. There is some significant difference, or so I would suggest. Kage
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Post by Caladors on Mar 10, 2004 18:56:08 GMT -5
I remeber my friends account of the orks there ment to be a slave race that was develeoped by the grechens and the grenchens all had super intellegance due to a speical fungus they ate however the orks became organised as organised as orks can get and attacked the grenchens becuase the grenchens had lost intellgence due to swelling numbers and when they got to there home world they didn't know what fungus was the one that game them super intellgence so they just ate everything so maybe this is why the grow as a fungus now because they ate something that allowed them to grow in this way and it was simlpy the most effective way of reproducing.
anyway my thoughts are that this is recessive knowelage that lies under the surface and can not be accessed coniously so there is no real way to gage how far it can be put to use however as far warp technology goes i don't think they can do anything on a large scale they mainly take over space hulks and just send them in the direction they want to go.
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Post by Kage2020 on Mar 14, 2004 6:19:19 GMT -5
I think I ran out of breath when reading that... That is basically a retelling of the original 'fluff' on the orks. Kage
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Post by zholud on Mar 14, 2004 15:10:58 GMT -5
I remeber my friends account of the orks there ment to be a slave race that was develeoped by the grechens and the grenchens all had super intellegance due to a speical fungus. Yes this was the story in the 1st and early 2nd edition of 40k, when Orks where just that clowns mimicking everything and willing to fight. Right now this has changed. The existence of Brain Boyz isn’t questioned, but two main hypotheses exist: - Orks are Krork race developed by Old Ones as ultimate guerrilla troops, who can be used while Slanns create a better weapon.
- Brain boyz were the Krork, better and wiser race, created as commanders for less developed part, but they died out one day.
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Post by Lordof on Mar 14, 2004 20:18:13 GMT -5
Orks would probably be able to get something which can function as a Warp Shield to a certain extent
They would of course have those which work a lot better and those which really don't work at all.
But i can't see orks Passing up the oopotunity of not having to make one and just stealing a Warp Drive
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