Khaela Mensha Khaine

Not quite sure how to respond to this one... Hmmn. I shall, however, try!


You'll have to put up a sound-bite for me somewhere, or point me to one. I only have the one from that turn-based strategy game that involved the eldar and whose name escapes me at the moment.

And personally I like referring to the Avatar as "The Bloody Handed". Just seems to 'pop' in my head, but there we go.


And it is somewhat horrifying since I consider that to be "fluff' lite", but that's because it has to take up space with 'boring' () wargame rules.


I would imagine in many ways it is the same as their feelings to 'paramount practitoners' of the Path: awe and fear. The Bloody Handed is representative of their 'mighty past', but is just a shadow of the pre-Fall power of that deity. It is, in many ways, a daemon incarnate (wouldn't the other daemons love to figure out how to do this! ) with all that implies and, when awakened, all the eldar feel its touch on their minds/souls. The awakening of the Bloody Handed is also associated with the eldar preparing for war and the potential death of 'loved ones'... Yet such war is normally to the advantage of the eldar, and when the Bloody Handed walks there is, arguably, a greater chance that the people will come through in one piece (relatively speaking).

So, 'awe' and 'fear' pretty much cut it for me.


That may be true, but as a parallel point I think it is very important that we remember that it is mythology. The premise that the eldar record their history solely in the form of dances and myth is something that I find tenuous, at least when represented as 'pure fact' rather than an interpretation. That eldar prefer to represent history in these terms is another issue.

Anyway, it remains 'myth' and should be viewed as such. Hence the whole horrendous nightmare about gods incarnating, Vaul actually creating the Talismans that bear his name, etc.

Again, that's a parallel issue. Some people prefer to view things in this way since it buys into the new technofantasy approach to the 40k universe... Me? I prefer that integration with the universe and the 'fluff', rather than Rule of Cool adoption of the Image in exclusion to everything else.

Erm, sorry... I've just been talking about that on another forum. Apologies for the overflow.


Ynnaed? Are you quite sure?


While Khaine was defeated, his escape was a result of a greater conflict between Khorne and Slaanesh.

It wasn't that... it was just a bit strange.


One tries.


I think so. Or maybe that was the copy that was corrupted, I'm not sure. I don't remember being impressed by it, but then again I'm very rarely impressed by GW products as a whole.


That and the fact that this is an entity that can reach across their mental barriers and bring forth that 'bloodthirsting' part of their souls... For a 'race' that is predicated around, for me, the control of their emotions (or the extremes of their emotions) this would put the willies up any of them.


I merely work on the premise that any 'entity' requires an 'avatar' in the matterium; a link. Sure, as with greater daemons you can fully manifest in a true form but doing such requires huge expenditures of energy. Even then you're damaging the fabric of reality and altering the balance of the warp, as well as making yourself vulnerable to attack from within...

It is also important to note that an Avatar of a 'god' is different than a daemon. Daemons have a distinct will that is aspected by the governing deity but which is generally distinct. Avatars are that deity and can access all the power that the deity has at their disposal.

When 'Khaine' mainfested to fight Kaelis-Ra he did so in an Avatar. Just as when Khaine 'killed' Kaelis-Ra it wasn't permanent, so to would it have been had Kaelis-Ra killed Khaine. For a comical film reference, one would imagine that it is a similar situation to Pirates of the Caribbean... "Ah we be two immortals locked in eternal conflict" or somesuch.

Amusingly enough it is consistent with all the 'fluff', requires no Revisionism (since we already know that Avatars are possible with the Bloody Handed anyway; they have even been mentioned in recent 'fluff') and only the partial construction in hand-wavium because of limiting the physical manifestation of gods!

The only bit that makes me still twitch is the idea that Vaul actually went about 'creating' artefacts. That's a bit too "technofantasy" for me, and I prefer to see metaphor there. But it works either way.


Isha is the 'Mother Goddess' figure, while Lileath is more the 'Crone'. It's strange that GW didn't include the typical Maiden in with that, but there we go.

Ynnaed, on the other hand, is the synergistic god born out of the Eternal Matrix. (And that for me is composed of the total energy of the Eternal Matrix, the Webway proto-sentience and also the Webway's most famous resident!)


The 'fluff'. WD127, for one.