Post by Kage2020 on Oct 29, 2004 6:27:00 GMT -5
On a personal note, Destecado, the same request applies to you as with Phillip. While you don't quite have the prolific use of colour as he does, I point out that trying to read text in colour gives me a blinding headache. Could we avoid it where possible. Perhaps just use bold? Or a quote or something?
I appreciate any help that you can give me on this matter. ;D
Actually, it merely points out that at the end of the warp entity known as Kaela Mensha Khaine was able to invest its total essence into the various 'Avatars', or at least the centre of the craftworlds which then expressed itself as the Avatars. As to the Laughing God, the idea that it is physically wondering around is, for me, untenable... Rather that it is linked to the Webway itself... But that's my bag.
Thus we work with the basic premise: for continued existence, all warp forms must 'possess' an entity of appropriate power. Of course, the wargame rules allow for them to bridge the gap in certain areas but such is draining and temporary.
Furthermore, one must consider that Khorne might wish to do this and, after all, there is no real reason why not... But then again is the mention of the 'Avatar of Khorne' in Storm of Iron telling?
To be fair, along with the emotive aspect they have been pretty much consistently represented as such, although the specific statement might not have been in keeping with that.
Although to be fair, the common representation of the eldar is that they are still slaved to that time through a rather visceral relationship with their 'myths', their primary means of understanding their past. (This I don't necessarily agree with, though it might be true to an extent with something as distant as the WiH.)
Don't you apologise for that... the process is often far more interesting and useful than, necessarily, the result.
As I stated above, I would say that 'worship' as a defined and continual process would be the incorrect way of looking at things. It is all a matter of remembrance since the eldar gods understand that, pretty much, the gods are dead. I would argue that they also do not worship Khaine or the Laughing God, merely treat them with the respect that a powerful entity deserves.
It will do, but between myself and 'Fenric writing up PhDs (now just 'Fenric, but I'm off to the States and going through all the preparations that that requires), it's running later than I would imagine. It is also something that, unlike the rest of the project (parallel or otherwise), is being developed with RPG in mind... Thus there is a continual process of iteration with the 'fluff' and the mechanics so that they properly relate to each other and the established 'fluff' as much as possible.
It's not quite as easy as writing a bit of colour text for a few unit types and, indeed, hardly makes mention to the wargame at all...
Seems that Sikkukkut shares at least that with me...
I welcome you to post something to this board about that, even though it is more 'general discussion'. This is a strong part of the eldar image and one that I tend to get twitchy about, the idea that the eldar only relate to their 'past' in generic forms rather than through the process of recording history, and then multiply translating it...
Of course, for such distant events in many ways a stylised representation would keep to the core of the event and allow the interpretation of the individual at a more fundamental level other than the dried interpretation of historians... That I agree with. I just am very careful that they do not record the political speech which occurred the previous week in a dance or couched with obtuse references to gods, dead or otherwise.
With tongue-in-cheek comments aside, it would be interesting to see...
I appreciate any help that you can give me on this matter. ;D
Originally posted by Destecado:
This seems to point to atleast some eldar gods having a physical form.
This seems to point to atleast some eldar gods having a physical form.
Actually, it merely points out that at the end of the warp entity known as Kaela Mensha Khaine was able to invest its total essence into the various 'Avatars', or at least the centre of the craftworlds which then expressed itself as the Avatars. As to the Laughing God, the idea that it is physically wondering around is, for me, untenable... Rather that it is linked to the Webway itself... But that's my bag.
Thus we work with the basic premise: for continued existence, all warp forms must 'possess' an entity of appropriate power. Of course, the wargame rules allow for them to bridge the gap in certain areas but such is draining and temporary.
Furthermore, one must consider that Khorne might wish to do this and, after all, there is no real reason why not... But then again is the mention of the 'Avatar of Khorne' in Storm of Iron telling?
Originally posted by Destecado:
Being that the eldar are a psychic race, the beings that they view as their gods may have been nothing more than manifestations of the combine mental energies.
Being that the eldar are a psychic race, the beings that they view as their gods may have been nothing more than manifestations of the combine mental energies.
To be fair, along with the emotive aspect they have been pretty much consistently represented as such, although the specific statement might not have been in keeping with that.
Originally posted by Destecado:
...which might make what I said above a moot point.
...which might make what I said above a moot point.
Although to be fair, the common representation of the eldar is that they are still slaved to that time through a rather visceral relationship with their 'myths', their primary means of understanding their past. (This I don't necessarily agree with, though it might be true to an extent with something as distant as the WiH.)
Originally posted by Destecado:
Although the above arguments appear contradictory, I have left them rather than editing the post, so that readers can follow the thought process that lead me to the conclusions I have made about the eldar gods.
Although the above arguments appear contradictory, I have left them rather than editing the post, so that readers can follow the thought process that lead me to the conclusions I have made about the eldar gods.
Don't you apologise for that... the process is often far more interesting and useful than, necessarily, the result.
Originally posted by malika:
Im curious, are the other Eldar Gods still worshipped?
Im curious, are the other Eldar Gods still worshipped?
As I stated above, I would say that 'worship' as a defined and continual process would be the incorrect way of looking at things. It is all a matter of remembrance since the eldar gods understand that, pretty much, the gods are dead. I would argue that they also do not worship Khaine or the Laughing God, merely treat them with the respect that a powerful entity deserves.
Originally posted by malika:
An off topic question to Kage: is the The Eldar Sourcebook ever going to be put out...I mean as in for all of us to read, or is it and will it remain a fully private thing?
An off topic question to Kage: is the The Eldar Sourcebook ever going to be put out...I mean as in for all of us to read, or is it and will it remain a fully private thing?
It will do, but between myself and 'Fenric writing up PhDs (now just 'Fenric, but I'm off to the States and going through all the preparations that that requires), it's running later than I would imagine. It is also something that, unlike the rest of the project (parallel or otherwise), is being developed with RPG in mind... Thus there is a continual process of iteration with the 'fluff' and the mechanics so that they properly relate to each other and the established 'fluff' as much as possible.
It's not quite as easy as writing a bit of colour text for a few unit types and, indeed, hardly makes mention to the wargame at all...
Originally posted by Sikkukkut:
To me, Eldar spirituality is about mourning their gods and trying to carry on their memory and heritage...
To me, Eldar spirituality is about mourning their gods and trying to carry on their memory and heritage...
Seems that Sikkukkut shares at least that with me...
Originally posted by Sikkukkut:
That doesn't exactly parallel my image of the Eldar relationship with their mythic cycles, which I imagine to be all-consuming and all-defining, but it hints at it.
That doesn't exactly parallel my image of the Eldar relationship with their mythic cycles, which I imagine to be all-consuming and all-defining, but it hints at it.
I welcome you to post something to this board about that, even though it is more 'general discussion'. This is a strong part of the eldar image and one that I tend to get twitchy about, the idea that the eldar only relate to their 'past' in generic forms rather than through the process of recording history, and then multiply translating it...
Of course, for such distant events in many ways a stylised representation would keep to the core of the event and allow the interpretation of the individual at a more fundamental level other than the dried interpretation of historians... That I agree with. I just am very careful that they do not record the political speech which occurred the previous week in a dance or couched with obtuse references to gods, dead or otherwise.
With tongue-in-cheek comments aside, it would be interesting to see...